We’re commenting so that amazon doesn’t only see the pvp’ers demanding the same thing over and over and over again and assume that everyone wants those things. They need to hear the counterpoints, the opinions of those standing against those wants.
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The problem isn’t no one flagging, it’s that the world is too big for the given max population. I was running around on Sunday evening harvesting near the hermit’s fishing spot and didn’t see a single player for over twenty minutes.
That’s why the PvP missions are for, they’re the same for each faction so that players will be drawn to the same areas in order to help facilitate combat.
The issue is that open-world PvP just kinda sucks, regardless of game. Bribing people to flag isn’t going to fix that. It’s just going to give the current flagged people some more stuff, but not more fun
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i’m commenting because i’m tired of someone ignoring the rather helpful little side menu that pops up and shows you… the exact same fucking posts you are about to repeat… and people clearly not even attempting to see if their idea has been already suggested a dozen times or more already.
Hey, got an actual ping from the other thread being linked lol.
I see you are looking for more wPvP incentives, the biggest concern on adding luck or the likes is that people will simply not flag.
I do PvX based on what I feel like doing I flag or not. If I head to farm some platinum ore, I will be wearing luck armor most likely and not flag. Why? Simply because if I get killed I will have to go all the way there and repeat. Forced to flag for extra luck is a bribe for getting me into content I wouldn’t want and if what you dread happens, it will start killing the game for you.
That is what PvE players don’t want, feel forced to participate on a content they aren’t interested. If you find a miner flagged, they will simply run, there is no fight, there is no skill, just kick down someone who won’t fight back.
In the thread that was linked, there are ideas to make PvP more engaging without affecting PvE players. I get what you say about wPvP being little. Somehow, my server has it on a healthy spot despite being low pop.
But as mentioned, is better to add incentives for people that don’t flag because the price is too harsh for dying.
Bonus gold, char and weapon exp, no armor damage, area standing bonuses and the likes are ideas that tackle directly into PvP without hurting PvE. But bribing someone who won’t fight back won’t solve the wPvP problem at all.
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i think luck is a good thing, you can also fight people for mining spots, theres nothing more annoying when someone kites a bunch of stuff to you and steals your nodes and you can’t fight them because they’re not flagged, so i disagree with what you’re saying
That is a different issue and not every resource has mobs nearby to drag and push you away.
You really think those who bring stuff to kick you off a node will flag even with luck?
It doesn’t matter how many incentives you justify it won’t make anymore people flag.
If you want more pvp and more players doing pvp then you need to improve the environment and mechanics for it to make it enjoyable.
I will never flag for pvp for a % increase in xp or gathering. Because being zerged, ganked, griefed and trolled isn’t worth it at all. Nor is having to walk back to where I was before when I inevitable die in completely imbalanced fights.
The ultimate issue is most pvpers already are flagged. You need to find a way to encourage the rest of the players to try and opt into pvp. This means making it fun and enjoyable, not forcing people into an unfair position for meager boosts.
I 100% agree that they should add a luck bonus when gathering resources while flagged for pvp. 10% might be a bit much, but I am all for it.
I love pvp, but even I would not flag when gathering resources at the moment because I need to use full luck gear which is not really optimal for pvp fights. It is all risk for no reward. If I got additional luck % by flagging I would want to take the risk for sure.
Great idea
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Yeah, most PvPer will already be flagged but those who play both sides (I’d dare say extreme PvP & PvE are a minority vs PvX) have encountered plenty of jerkish behavior to stop flagging until high leve IF they are still thinking on flagging.
I’d still say area level caps would fix at least 2 out of the 4 problems you listed. Soft cap levels to highest area level ans leave weapon mastery be the advantage on a fight.
If im 60 and go flagged to FL, have my level go down to 25 with respective stats. That way I cannot terrorize newbies out of sheer stats, as if they gang up, there will actually be a more realistic sense of “We can do it” for them and make the fights more fun as the high level will also have risk.
Yeah, there is a bit of scaling regarding PvP, but even still, as a lvl 12 flagged player, seeing a flagged lvl 60 walk through the road or gank you is a free trip back to the town. If I see a lvl 25, is easier to think there is a chance and stand your ground. And while all the “PvP fears” do happen, they aren’t as constant as we might think but sadly, the fear itself keeps many players off flagging.
I posted this in a different thread:
I feel this would be a far better solution to the situation.
Thats a good idea as well
I disagree.
If you enjoy PvP and are willing to fight and die for resources you should be rewarded, not the other way around.
When you choose NOT to flag your reward is being impervious to player attacks and you are unable to be taken out of the competition for resources. Thus making it more efficient to be unflagged especially when you consider they also benefit from flagged players removing eachother from the equation.
You have to respect flagged players increased time investment, if you dont incentivize flagging you arent doing that.
10% boost to luck is basically acknowledging it takes a flagged player at least 10% more time to do the same task as an unflagged player because we have to stay alert and fight others players.
When you say “I don’t want to be “forced” to flag for benefits” it essentially translates to “I want the benefits but not the risks involved.” Its your CHOICE. Your time is valuable whether PvP or not it should be fairly rewarded.
Also I am interested in expanding both PvE/PvP while keeping things fair.
I have my own ideas for this but made a post because it is expansive.
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we need a bonus for flagging max level I agree.
being followed around all day by unflag guys stealing my resource and just being there to ruin your drop.
Just read through it. Here is my intake, forgive me for not breaking down as I’m on mobile atm.
Incentivate flagging can be done without stepping over the PvE aspect of the game. The game core principle goes around PvP but you need to keep it healthy for both sides. I don’t know the situation in your server or if I’m simply too carefree (which I am) that if there are resource nodes being taken by other players, I just continue to the next node of my route.
If I’m flagged, am I really looking to go do some mining? I have to drop my PvP gearset and get a luck set for the specific activity in order to enhance further my results. If I get attacked, my performance on the fight will be already dropping. So, do I flag to find fights or do I flag just for an advantage over those who don’t wish to partake in PvP activities?
I honestly don’t even think on “Am I being rewarded for being flagged?” But if I was to do it, I’d rather get X amount of gold every Y minutes. That is one reward I’d prefer rather than some luck. It wouldn’t only alleviate the repair cost but would also help me stock up more gold to buy better gear/consumables/QoL or even resources if I wanna level up professions without chopping trees.
Regarding your other post, I will reply there!
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And you think adding any % on the drop or lucky will change the fact that you can waste your time grouping up and spending all the Azoth to travel for nothing?
Do not matter how much more you can get, not flagged you have 100% chance to succeed in getting something on your farm and will not be killed forcing you to go back to the starting point.
Getting something in X time is always better than getting nothing in this X time.
While I would primarily refer to myself as PvP player its a misnomer in games like this as you must ebrace all aspects the game has to offer in order to achieve a deeper experience.
To answer your question you have to understand PvP is more varied than hunting players to kill them, it’s about immersing yourself in a dangerous “new” world (see what I did there?). When I flag I am vulnerable and what I choose to do while flagged suddenly inherits more meaning because it’s now life or death. I shouldn’t be relegated to just hunting players down while flagged because that would become a very shallow experience.
In a game where everyone is always vulnerable all things are considered equal but in a game where you can choose to be or not, that is no longer the case. Game mechanics need to make adjustments to lessen the disparity between these experiences. Because the experience of a flagged player is diluted by a nonflagged player but not the other way around.
I think coexistence creates problems that need solutions to make up the difference. Which is what post like these are all about.
I agree, the balance on this cases is extremely difficult because you need to really attempt to draw a line that doesn’t lean yo any side but a middle point.
I haven’t considered about the thrill of just being flagged for fun without a set objective and not just because my objective was to have some fights.
I don’t really have a preference on play style tbh. I usually do what tickles my fancy and that’s why I didn’t consider it before. However giving more benefits to PvE while flagged can result on bad things.
I still stand that luck is not the ideal solution, but I am pretty sure the objective shouldn’t feel like a bribe for those PvE ones but an incentive for those who play PvX, something more neutral like azoth and gold.
Right now, my thrill on PvP doesn’t feel diluted by other players taking resources but the feel that I’m simply going on a lose of gold is what dilutes it for me. And that gold could be used to get those resources.
I do thank you for the input here that I didn’t consider before!
As many people have pointed out, the best way to lessen the disparity is to provide more things for PvP players to do, not just give them more stuff because pressed the hard-mode button.
If you want more/better PvP you need more people willing to PvP. And few people are going to flag just for some extra luck. Those that do most likely aren’t looking to PvP and are just going to run away.
So what are you getting out of this? Bonus loot for the exact same experience you have now but with a slightly increased chance to ambush a normally-PvE player who is busy doing something else.
You’d get a lot more support from the non-hardcore PvP crowd if you stopped asking for more loot and asked for more content instead.
PvP isn’t the super dangerous mode everyone makes it out to be because so few people flag. I rarely see flagged players unless I’m running around in a zone that’s being actively contested.
And no-one flags because open-world PvP sucks. And even with +100% bonuses to gather amount or huge luck increases, most of us don’t want to worry about getting murdered because we need some more life motes or green wood. It’s just not fun.
Give us a reason to flag and we will, but more stuff ain’t it.
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I remain a supporter of global incentives for flagged players but respect your viewpoint.
But on the point of more varied PvP content we are in the same camp. That’s actually what my linked post is about. And not just PvP because for every mission I proposed there is a PvE alternative.
Edit: I am the flagged player willing to fight for my resources. If I am chased away or chase someone else away the effect is the same. You dont have to kill or be killed to engage in PvP you just have to be a threat capable of removing another threat.
Also. I would consider game mechanics that convince those to flag who normally wouldnt a HUGE SUCCESS. It means that beyond a doubt it is worth the risk.
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