Elite Chest and Zergs are the Problem

General Discussion General Discussion
136

except, thats a choice, not a requirement. I have been in a zerg about two times, for about 15 minutes each. And I have been 60 since like 1-2 weeks after release

you can go with a five man group, you can solo it, you can ignore it and dungeons, you can do the daily gypsums, You can craft.

its a choice not a requirement, many people don’t do it. Now maybe you can say the expertise system should have better options than dungeons or chests, but there is nothing inherently wrong with what people are doing now.

I can tell you from most MMOs that actually have it, open world large group easy to moderate difficulty content is extremely popular, and people show up to do it often. As long as it is even moderately rewarding, many people do it and love it. My guess its the ease of access(just show up), being a part of a large group without a big gate, and usually decent rewards.

GW2 had champion trains, and WvW trains. Ffxiv had fates, and later eureka and some other things.

And none of these contents were the best rewards in the game. The devs would some times nerf or limit them and they would spring up elsewhere in New forms. Eventually designers embraced it, and made the content better and more engaging. Then they don’t zerg the things not designed for zergs anymore.

This is not something they should prevent, its something they need to build on and improve.

it’ll never be my favorite content, but as long as they have some content that appeals to me, its ok if they make things other players enjoy.

137

I actually agree with the sentiment that fresh 60s should not have to go through a perilous grind the way it is now.

But I think that the drop rates could simply be adjusted to make it much easier to get bumps. I think they would enjoy my proposition more if the drop rates were adjusted to not slow down but possibly even speed up the process

138

This is a separate issue, IMO. How AGS does mob aggro has from beta been just a griefing tool used to steal nodes – and here to make other people do all the work while they just collect rewards.

No other game has this type of mob aggro system, not even games from over 15 years ago.

139

If you’ve been 60 since a week after release and have only been in 2 zergs you may not understand the issue.

You were part of the original players that farmed the same mob to max gear score. Or if not that had other options. Things have changed

140

Im not projecting and yes you are in love with your idea. Its pretty apparent with all your discussion here. You call it a quick and easy fix. I say a quick and easy fix to what? Nobody is getting loot in Zergs. That was what you had a problem with. You might get lucky once in a blue moon and get a trophy mat. You can get that from any likewise chest in normal areas. There is no loot coming from these boxes of any worth. Its all just WM farming. Who cares about that?

Its a conversation starter to something that isn’t a problem. Who cares about the Zerg? Why does it matter so much?

I am frustrated with the HWM grind. Its a stupid pointless RNG grind so that you can do the real rng on top of rng grind for the actual gear in the dungeons. It is there entirely because there is a lack of end game content. None of that sounds amazing. Your solution doesn’t fix that problem. You know what fixes that problem? Removing watermark/expertise/umbral what ever they want to call it next.

The gear is already sparse and random enough that its not needed. You going WM for months. Then you grind for a key to a dungeon or grind gold. Then you grind the actual fun content and pray to the rng gods that something drops. Then you pray its something that you will use. Then you pray that its got the right stat. Then you pray that the perks actually match what you use. Cause god knows we all LOVE getting that Dex/Focus sword with a fire staff perk!! Doesn’t THAT sound amazing?

You are trying to have some solution to a problem that doesn’t really exist. The problem is not the Zerg. The problem is the WM grind itself and the way too broad RNG. Also the fact that there are only two dungeons. Also that you have to grind key parts just to do said dungeon. Its freaking ridiculous.

I just want to play like every other MMO on the planet… Hey guys wanna go do this dungeon!! Sure lets go!!.. and just go do it because you can. Oh sorry buddy no one has a key. Lets go farm for a few hours over here. Then go farm faction over there for few hours. Maybe we can do it in a few days. Sounds great!!! Oh wait its not even worth it man. My WM is still at 540. See you in a couple months bros.

You are trying to find a solution to where there is no problem.

You haven’t heard anything that makes you think your idea is terrible because you don’t want to hear it. The fact is you idea isn’t needed and it won’t work. There will be constant griefing for no reason. Constant waiting in line or trying to out gun the other group for no reason. Constant people training through. Constant people coming in trying to snipe the loot. Thats why its a terrible idea. You can try and math away at it but its already proven everywhere that this is what happens. That is why your idea is bad.

141

A lot of people hate the Zerg. If you think it’s great then it makes your perspective make sense. Many including myself disagree

142

I don’t think its great. I think its a means to an end for a junk end game system. Nothing more. However, I also don’t hate it or think its a problem.

Would you care to explain why the Zerg is somehow a big problem and needs a solution?

143

I already did. You think that I think it’s a problem because I’m in love with my idea. You pretty much made it personal rather than discussing alternatives. What more is there to say to you?

144

Yeah zergs aren’t for loot. I did them pretty religiously for like a month and saw… 2 legendary items? Went last night and got the worst legendary bow in the history of everything.

Crafting mats, maybe, but you’re better off running solo or with a buddy on the trophy mats for stockpiles in the upper zones. Zergs in general don’t seem to net them very much. I think I’ve seen 1 legendary trophy mat out of all my zerg running, and 4-5 epics.

145

I agree. It’s like everyone else has stated I only do them for the expertise bumps. But that’s true of literally everything you can do. The loot is just terrible.

That’s part of my point though. Make it so you have to kill stuff and adjust loot to make it meaningful.

146

I mean there are so many ways they could adjust the loot that are super simple to start with. Hell they could even add a very small chance of the bosses and mini bosses dropping dungeon orbs. Viola elite content feeds into dungeon content making it more assessable

147

The idea you posted is pretty good and well rounded for sure. However, I think it comes a bit late since it will leave other people like me with a sour taste because we missed another “easy door” before seeing it closed.

Since it is not my intention to contest your point of view in any regard, I’d like to brainstorm a little if I may. What if your idea comes alive using portals? Timegated instanced portals in that same end game zones were you could enter another dimension. Almost the same roadmap with a little tweaking to make it instanced, adjusted difficulty for 5, 10, N players and the rewards accordinly, and of course no damn orbs to enter either.

148

Its nothing personal. I don’t know you and have no feelings for you either way. Has nothing to do with personal. Ive explained 3 times why your idea is bad. Ive explained twice why the idea isn’t needed as it solves no problems. You cant even describe what problem you are trying to solve other than to say Zerg bad. So you are right, there is nothing more to say to you.

149

I’d be fine with that. I don’t mind instances at all. I just think those would be a lot more lengthy solutions for the devs to develop. I would just like them to make changes now in whatever ways are easy to implement and then work on stuff like that as well.

And I definitely sympathize with you and everyone else when it comes to making things more difficult. I wouldn’t want them to do anything to make it more difficult to grind Gear score. I honestly believe with shorter cooldowns like 6-8 hours in addition to buffing loot it will make it much easier. I could be wrong but they could always keep adjusting

150

You don’t know me but yet you claim to know I’m n love with an idea? It’s just silly. And yes I fully explained it in my original post and clarified it multiple times. Your arguments broke down to “your just in love with your idea that’s why you’re posting so much”.

That’s as simple minded as me telling you the only reason you’re against it is because you want an easy mode because you can’t do it without a Zerg. See how unproductive that is?

151

That wasn’t my only argument. You are deaf to it and won’t listen. Hence why I say you are in love with your idea. Thats what people in love with their idea do. They ignore all feedback that tells you why ideas are bad and then refuse to explain anything. Just like you have done for several posts now.

Start over… why is Zerg bad? I don’t want to scroll up 150 posts and reread a wall of text. Just start there and explain that.

152

Man really don’t want to re-litigate this with you. All of my points are laid out in the original post.

The loot being tied to chest which do not require any killing of enemies encouraged zergs because it is the fastest way to get what you want. Fast progression in the form of WM.

You have entire servers all just running through all of the elite zones at the prime time window which creates more of checklist of dailies rather than a sense of what would I like to do.

This further creates a vacuum of few players left outside of the Zerg windows to form groups with because everyone is on a 24 hour cooldown which is tied to the chest.

Making something easy or fast doesn’t mean it’s good and I’m positive this was not the developers intent. By your logic why wouldn’t we just stack up elite chest next to the Christmas trees in each settlement. All you have to do is log in each day and open them and hope for bumps. In effect it’s the exact same thing and whether you want to admit it or not I think you inherently know there is something wrong with it.

Many people know that too which is why everything feels so unfun. There is no risk/reward or sense of accomplishment associated with the current progression system.

153

I very specifically said crafting mats and yes zergs are a quick way to loot a ton of chests for mats. I see people on the runs saying they will buy mats from each other so it’s a thing even if people don’t realize it.

154

Ok so lets go over this from my perspective…

Loot being tied to chests is all garbage. Its pretty much WM only and even that’s if you are lucky. Fastest way takes months. Thats why people do the fastest way. Because the slowest way is even more of a boring slog fest for no reward. People Zerg because they don’t want to WM at all but they have to.

Yes entire servers full of people doing it. Your proposed solutions just make that worse because now entire servers are just waiting in line at each spot trying to snipe kills. Same old Zerg just now only up to 10 will get a chance at loot instead of everyone in your solution.

So in your solution everyone is on a cooldown tied to the mob instead yet they are all randomly on the cooldown because who knows who will get what when, when there are entire servers all camping mobs instead.

None of it is good. Its boring. Your solution takes boring, keeps it boring, and adds aggravation to it. You can already log in and Christmas tree a WM. Its actually guaranteed unlike chests and you can guarantee what you put the WM on unlike chests. Point moot.

I inherintly know there is something wrong with WM. Its not that its “easy to get by a Zerg.” It’s that it exists at all. Your solution doesn’t fix that. It makes it worse.

It feels unfun because its months long grind where the only reward is you get to double grind RNG for even more months. It doesn’t matter how they present that. It will always feel bad and unfun. Grinding the same mobs over and over with an extra aggravation factor of waiting in line to snip kills is not anymore fun. It is however more aggravating.

There would be no risk/reward or sense of accomplishment in your solution either.

And to add… in none of that have you explained why Zerg is bad, which is what I asked you. You only explained why the system itself is bad. The solution to that is to remove the system. A more simple and more easy fix than yours.

155

I’ve already made it clear they should adjust the loot and make the WM grind a little faster. I also made it clear they could do this in lots of different ways.

Bottom line is you hate the idea. You’ve made yourself very clear and I have noted your dissent. Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

I really hate getting into this because I think it’s unbecoming of civil people but you’re forcing my hand here.

I will break out the crayons because you are either very dense, like to argue, fail at reading, or are simply least which you eluded to by not wanting to read the thread.

Your question “why are zergs bad”

My Answer they don’t seem the intention of the developers, they take away all sense of accomplishments from individual players, players like to feel like they earned something not have it handed to them, they are basically a participation trophy, they create a vacuum of players because nearly everyone is on a 24 hour cooldown because everyone zerged at the same time.

I have repeated that multiple times in lots of different ways. You may not like the answer. But it is an answer. If you don’t like it or agree it’s time for you to move on. You made your disagreements clear.