How to play with a real tank

General Discussion General Discussion
1

So far, from what I’ve seen in 300+ hours, I believe a guide on how to play with a real tank in tough situations is in order. A real tank can take a beating, block, keep the aggro. Some dodging, at best. Not a bouncing pinball, that’s not a tank, that’s an aggro barbarian.

So far, all I’ve seen is a bunch of melee DPS rush toward a mob and healer(s) putting healing circle on top of them. That would account for 99.9% of the encounters. Sure, that works on medium to easy encounters. But it would be SO MUCH easier for tough encounters if people just knew how to play/use a tank.

First off, when you have a tank, you don’t need 3 melee DPS. 1 tank, 1 melee, 2 ranged, 1 healer. That should be for difficult situations where 1 tank is not enough. But usually, the ideal should be 1 tank, 3 ranged, 1 healer. I’ll explain why.

1- Let the tank go fetch a pack, come back into a funnel point and then the ranged DPS go wam bam goodnight 'mam. From what I’ve seen, the most common method is: more than one goes fetch, or attacks one of the pack, attracts aggro, tank goes fetch a few but the main group already has a bunch on them.

2- Funnel position. Since tanks can be easy to bounce around in this game, the best way to limit access to the range DPS is to let the tank use the environment, to make it easier to block the way. In a narrow corridor, it limits the amount of mobs that can attack too.

3- If the tank can keep the aggro and can walk backwards, stay behind the monster and attack from behind, backstab damage, etc… I do not understand why melee DPS goes between the tank and the monster, to get hit by the boss AOE, while it could only hit the tank. Stay behind and let the tank handle the aggro. A tank doesn’t need to hit to keep aggro. Trust me, in a chest run of 50 players, I can keep the aggro pretty easy without doing much damage.

“We need to stay in the healing circle!” No, you don’t. You won’t need the stay in the circle if you are behind the boss. :wink: Let the tank walk around the healing circle, if need be.

4- If the group cannot handle a full blown attack, ranged DPS should attract a few at a time. If the target is also range, walk backwards to attract it. Don’t stay too close to get the entire aggro. Happens all the time with the last Winter Warrior quest: melee goes fetch a few, woops, the entire cavern comes. Use the environment, go left of the cave, bring just a few at the cavern entrance, to only have the main Winter warrior to fight like a normal elite boss. See 1, 2 and 3.

Now, there are situations with the tank doesn’t do a good job, sure. I’ve done my share. I still have to improve. So, there’s where another melee can be useful if that happens. But not 4 melee and 1 healer.

I know this post will trigger STR+CON “tanks” that dodge like a thief. But that goes without saying: as long as you have fun with your character, that’s what matters. A S+S/GA tank needs 250 CON, a S+S/WH needs 300 CON, cuz the 300 CON perk is made for the WH.

Cuz the 250 CON is extremely useful in S+S mode, at the beginning, when healed, it’s just nuts.

That’s my 3-decade opinion on how to play with a tank. Players would be surprised how a difficult run can be easy when using the tank properly.

Alright, I’m ready for the tomatoes and flame.

5 Likes
2

Wow. What a hypocrite!

You spent the whole post saying not to have any melee DPS in higher-level dungeons.

And then you end it with “as long as you have fun with your character, that’s what matters”

Guess what. Melee DPS have good defense too. Like they can wear heavy armor, They can dodge. They can switch to sword shield to off-tank if you go down. They can kite. I can easily dodge and kite bosses if the tank goes down (cause the healer got agro/then killed and needed a revive). So Get off your high horse already.

3

So the TL:DR is tank tanks.

Until the healer heals once, then every ranged mob from here to narnia starts focus firing them

4 Likes
4

3 decade opinion? What were you tanking in 1991? Even more so what game (if it did exist lol) has similar mechanics in 1991 that it would translate over into games in 2021?

5

If you’ve been using this successfully, then that’s got to be a good thing. At least to me.

Of course there is a “however” :wink:

I’m becoming more and more convinced that tank’n’spank isn’t really what the designers were aiming for when they created the skills that allow for tanking.

Aggro is harder to hold and it seems the tank must be doing fairly good damage to keep aggro.

Another “however”.

This doesn’t mean there aren’t good points here.

This boggles the mind really. This can be seen in instanced dungeons, outdoor dungeons, and zergs. To get out of the way of it all and try to get to the back can be difficult at times as you need to sheathe your weapon to get past the crowd and to the backside.

There is a limited range for melee weapons as well. Sometimes in a zerg watching from the back one might wonder whether all of them are actually hitting the boss.

It’s also troubling that 90% or more expect LS users to heal them through it all.

This is what dodge was made for but also made more difficult when in a packed mob beating on something.

Just some random additional thoughts.

6

Eq for one.

7

So in this perfect world melee is only allowed for hard content, and everyone should be ranged except the tank? The shit crack are you smoking there piffy…

You have to understand also, the way attacking and collision works in this game, greatly hinders boss and tank placement, including the melee DPS… This is why melee DPS is always getting in front of attacks, because their regular swings took them there, or the BOSS swings shifted the tank, or the tank swings shifted the boss…

If you truly knew about high level end game tanking you would know how regular tanking, the proper way, will get your melee dps hit regularly… That is why the best tanks maintain agro and kite and only use blocks in emergency or calculated attacks (in dungeons)…

Out in the world, I pull 10+ mobs in lvl 66 Palace and take them to the blender like you said… You also gotta understand not everyone knows how agro works in this game… You should look up how threat works from the developers comments.

1 Like
8

in 1991? Try again.

9

You’re right eq was 99.

10

I’ve been online gaming since 1986, younglings. When text-based MUDs existed.

I’ve read the replies, and yes, there are howevers. First, real tanks are even more rare than healers. So, it’s not obvious to get one in a party. So, yes, 2-3 melee DPS is the norm right now. But when I see melees stick between me and the boss, getting hit by the heavies and AOEs, when they wouldn’t if they were behind it, it boggles my mind.

Yes, we CAN play a real tank in this game. With a great tank Tower shield with Sturdy, Refreshing move or evasion, can stick himself in a corner and let the group hit from behind.

I know how threat/taunt/aggro works. Those that say that a tank needs to do damage to keep aggro, do not. Healers can steal aggro easy if a group is in a bunch. Healer doesn’t do damage. :wink:

Also, yes @Scullz , that’s how a tank should play, get all the aggro, bring them back, let the group finish them off. I have yet to see one tank do that all the time. I try, but those pesky squishy DPS always get in the way. :smiley:

11

I think he just meant that it was a long post

12

the game need more tanking weapons

1 Like
13

So you want melee dps to play some other game instead of this one?

14

Just use 4 dps and a healer. Tanks are not needed yet in this joke of a game.

15

I go with spear as secondary weapon, tried hatchet and war hammer and I like spear the most.
As for attributes, I was asking around a discussing this at length eventually settled at 200con which is good enough for vast majority of pve content. I will go 300con the moment they switch grit from 300str to 300con.

Before I was lvl 60 I was thinking I’m just gonna aim for 500 con, just like some 18k tank monster, there was one guy who was going with it on my server and he became a meme but in a good sense, people liked him in pve and pvp. But I don’t know if it makes such a difference.
I haven’t found how much dmg you need as a tank in this game.
Some say there is no issue to keep aggro even with 5 str as long as you are specced into tank and have right gems, some say you need to do some damage to keep that aggro.
In the end both group high str and high con builds claim they have no problem keeping aggro.

16

EQ is 1999. Only games in 1991 were MUDs and such… i mean, we didnt event have harddrives in our computers…

17

Tank for the past 500h or so out of 850+. I don’t know if we play the same game but since when is 250 and 300 perk are useful ?

18

I think the op is trying to be helpful but the guide lost its usefulness when it attempts to dictate that groups should optimally be tank, 3x range and a healer. This just isn’t true and depends on the encounter.

Taunt mechanics essentially place the tank on top of the threat list when they hit. Beyond that, the tank needs to be generating threat through damage and perks and dps/heals can mitigate their threat by taking care how they do their jobs. The tank needs to know how limited their aoe taunt range is, be the puller and dictate the starting position, then manage their stamina and allow the push to happen by moving with it (leading). The latter isn’t always practical and so sometimes the tank needs to just back to the wall and wait for the mob to stamina drop or look for a gap to stop blocking and move out.

The optimal scenario is healers/void understand when the tank stamina is depleted and can throw stamina boosts down. Comms help a lot here but you’ll not get that in most pickup groups. If the healer or dps gets agro, it’s not helpful to run about (unless agreed to kite, though if you need to kite then you might need a stronger tank). Move the chasing mobs closer to the tank so they can hit them and get agro back. Running about makes it almost impossible for a tank to do anything if stuff is on CD. Good tanks will be aware of this and may be able to chase but that’s not optimal.

Every boss encounter is different. If you’re seeing ping pong before a boss, you need to change strategy early.

As dps, I always let my tank land some hits then engage. Healers should try to do the same but that’s not always practical. Mob initial threat calculation is often prox only so make sure heavy melee non tanks stand ahead of squishy ones.

Just some basic tips. Not in depth.

2 Likes
19

How about just plain HP? At 200 con with HP amulet you have around 12k, at 300con you can have 15k+ …

Wouldnt that save you in myrk/genesis/lazarus?

20

Sure. One hit. Maybe two. Meanwhile 300 Strength turns you into an immovable GOD. Since tanking with a shield is so easy in this game, the reward far outweighs the risk.