Human Error? Nowhere to turn

I am reaching out here and what I view as the last hope and hopefully to become a source of information for those who have explored every other option after being denied their ban appeal.

The reason I am reaching out here is I am hoping a Dev can see this as I truly believe they will understand more than anyone how devastating a false positive can be not just to the victim but also the entire group/company/community they play with. With the chaos going on around the game and what I can imagine is massive amounts of bans and customer service tickets I can only assume human error is at play and if that is the case I am begging devs to find a way for those who truly are innocent to further there concerns.

Currently my friends only option is to wait out the time period for Amazon to issue him his SAR and use that as evidence in public forums to raise awareness to his plight. I am willing to stake my account that if a dev looks into his case they will see he is innocent.

Mangy - Adiri
Details: https://www.reddit.com/r/newworldgame/comments/qm247g/permanently_banned_for_selling_gold_when_i_have/

Update: https://www.reddit.com/r/newworldgame/comments/qmutji/unfair_ban_appeal_process_permabanned_for/

And unfortunately I am concerned he is not the only one in this situation. I have seen similar threads to his currently appearing on reddit and steam forums and since they are unable to post here I am hoping to gain some guidance from AGS as to what options are available for anyone who are in this position if any at all.

Thanks.

3 Likes

TLDR: Good luck dudes, hopefully you get an actual review at least. This has me concerned about all trades/chat now.

Can we get an orange post explaining the identification, review and actioning process with a clear set of guidelines about what words/phrases/actions trigger “disruptive behaviour”?

EG: If a friend needs one more void ore, and I send them 10k so they can buy it from the auction house and jokingly say " that’ll cost you $10 lol", is that grounds for a permanent ban?
What if I have another friend who is terrible with gold and needs 1k for repairs on a daily basis? Is this repatitive action of sending gold considered suspect?

Long Version:

There appears to be more and more of these posts popping up. Voidbent sales/trades with some element of proof of farming/crafting. Auctioneers with buy/sell spreadsheets etc.

In these threads showing appeal responses its the same thing, blanket email with EXACT same text. “Warranted, we will not respond to further questions” not answering the question of why. Isn’t this essentially totalitarianism?

Having to request a log of account activity (which takes a month apparently) seems like the burden of proof is on the accused, yes I know this is not the judicial system, yes it’s a game with a code of conduct and I whole heartedly support a 0 tolerance policy… but as soon as you get one false positive the process needs review, as do those impacted.

I just want to understand more about it so I can ensure that I am complicit because I am legitimately enjoying the game (even with its issues). But all I can take away from this at the moment is “don’t say dumb s%#t”, noted.

2 Likes

Hey there.

The only thing I can think of to prove 100% no gold-selling happened is for your friend to send into the ban appeal a copy of their bank statement, pay pal to recent transactions ect ect for that time period, blank out their account number ect ect, but show them that there has been no foul play.

sorry I can not offer any other help, thats the only 100% way of proving his innocence I can think of.

1 Like

Just bumping this too see if we can get a Dev to see it and hopefully respond.

Our friend has received a second email the exact same copy paste email except now this time saying the ban stays but its for ‘spamming’ instead of ‘gold selling’.

Something isn’t working like it supposed to.

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Once again bumping this - hoping for any word from AGS.

Thanks.

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Hey Guys,

Reaching out again with hopes of an update. I also have put together some new information.

This thread here: Unfair PER-BAN.. PLS HELP! - #26 by Xeed

Player’s friend is reaching out on behalf of the player they believe was hit with a false positive perma ban. Customer Service rep @Cathulhu responds assuring the OP that the ban has been checked and is legit for ‘cheating’. 24 hours later the banned player in question responds to the thread saying “Thank all for help look like iam unbaned.”

Screenshot: http://prntscr.com/1you5vw

One of the people that have reached out to my friend with almost the exact same circumstances around their ban has now been unbanned after the 3rd appeal attempt with them having added no extra information other than a screenshot of them hitting level60.

I have removed his personal information from the screenshots but have originals if a Dev requires.

Screenshot1: http://prntscr.com/1youedg
Screenshot2: http://prntscr.com/1youjwb

There are more instances and stories we have discovered and I plan to keep digging as I believe nothing will kill a game like this faster than false permanent bans on innocent players.

For most of you that have read this far you have everything you need to know above. Now for my rant on why I believe this is such a huge problem.

As someone who has worked in esports for many years and have had the good fortune of being able to travel the world to many events supporting my teams across different titles I was AMAZED when this game launched. I had never seen so many of my different gaming circles all playing the same game at once. FPS players, MOBA players, even a bunch of my casual friends so I knew I had to get onboard. Everyone here knows playing with a group of friends makes a game 1000x better and for me this game had so many people playing.

At first launch was a bit rough - especially for those who couldn’t ‘no life’ a game getting caught in brutal queue times. That however was handled pretty quickly and everyone moved on with leveling. Over time more of the bugs and QOL issues popped up and some people stopped playing for a while. The huge amount of friends that where playing in the first couple of weeks had dwindled and only the hardcore few had remained. All of this in my opinion is somewhat normal with a game like this and what tends to happen is:

  • The hardcore players push through
  • New content and updates get released
  • Game becomes closer to finished product and the hardcore players attract a large amount of their friends back to play.

This is what I believe is going to help drive players back into the game.

Now let me tell you what I think happens when someone gets a false perma ban. That entire circle of friends never come back. This has been the hardest part about all of this for me personally. For those of us that pushed through all bugs etc this has been like a punch in the gut. Not only have you falsely banned our friend and labelled him a gold seller then spammer you have now removed all possibility that any of the others in our extended friend circle even come back to the game. So not only has this false positive ban ruined the victim of it. It has ruined the game for the rest of us who powered through the bugs because we saw the potential for many years of fun gaming.

A game like this can have some pretty big mistakes, bugs, exploits and still bounce back due to the simple fact that above all else you guys have built something beautiful with massive potential.

However in my opinion there is no coming back from a wave of false positives as the ongoing effect of that will completely ruin a game for anyone affected and a large portion of their friends/community permanently.

Now it’s fair to say that it’s probably too late for me and my friend group. With how much I love the game I am going to have a very hard time convincing people to come back, even if you guys rectify my friend’s problem. So for the next group of people that are in the same position we are - Please I beg of you to look into this issue before it’s too late, because if it continues I believe the game will suffer greatly.

More than happy to speak to anyone from Customer Service or the Dev team - I am also available on twitter and discord too and am more than happy to dox myself too AGS if required.

2 Likes

Bump

Bumping again and tagging @Kay as you seem to be one of the more active Dev’s.

Please any information at this point would be greatly appreciated.

2 Likes

In the last few days I have seen 15-20 reports of bans being revoked. They all seem to follow the same process, no warning, ban imposed, 1st appeal is denied, 2nd appeal is denied, 3rd appeal is accepted and ban revoked.

This means false positives are occurring and it’s the customer who needs to relentlessly follow up before any action is taken.

@Kay @Luxendra @Lane @Zin_Ramu @TrevzorFTW @DaveNW @NW_Mugsy

This isn’t in line with Amazon core values, customer obsession, ownership, bias for action, earn trust, dive deep, have backbone.

As per my post above, can we get an understanding of the identifacion process?

Bot picks it up, human reviews?? Player submits, human reviews? Bot picks it up, Bot responds twice, human reviews on the 3rd appeal?

It would also be pertinent to supply even a small amount of proof to perma bans… this is capital punishment for beloved characters, give them a reason at least.

3 Likes

Well AGS, our boy has given up.

Your cold impersonal disconnection from customers has broken our collective spirit.

Just when the game was actually getting good, such a shame.

Please have some backbone and acknowledge you have a problem, here is another example of automated bans not working.

Roll the bans back, start again.

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Hi travelers!!

@illspokensociety , @Trollio , sorry to hear the inconveniences on your account and the ban.

I understand you have appeal multiple time already and the answers are not the satisfactory, all bans and appeal are reviewed by the Amazon Games team and multiple agents to confirm a violation have been commit.

By polities no information about the reason will be share other than the violation of the Code of Conduct, if you believe that your case require a new evaluation, please proceed to create a new appeal explaining you actual situation (if you have use any 3rd party application that can interfere), refer this post for more visibility and please provide any picture or proof that your are not a bot, cheater or gold seller if your case is a little different.

https://www.amazongames.com/en-us/support/new-world/articles/appeal-a-ban

On the forums of course we are ready to provide any help-information you could need, but any ban process have always need to be handle by the Special Team and with the Ban Appeals.

Thanks and have a nice weekend!!