Overwolf Minimap Addon - AGS your stance is not clear at all!

Hey Everyone,

What is a minimap

The definition of a minimap is pretty clear across a lot of the internet, from game to game and the following description describes what a minimap is/does.

A mini-map or minimap is a miniature map that is often placed at a screen corner in video games to aid players in orienting themselves within the game world. They are often only a small portion of the screen and must be selective in what details they display. Elements usually included on mini-maps vary by video game genre. However, commonly included features are the position of the player character, allied units or structures, enemies, objectives, and surrounding terrain.

Mini-maps have become very common in real-time strategy and MMORPG video games because they serve as an indication of where the current screen lies within the scope of the game world. Most first person shooter games also have some version or variant of the mini-map, with the odd exception of Call of Duty: Modern Warfare, often showing enemy and teammates locations in real-time.

Second Monitor Maps

In all sorts of games lots of players load up maps on their second monitor to help them navigate the worlds, find loot, quests… etc as they tend to always have a lot more information on them that the game doesn’t have.

Just look at the following web interface for a 3rd party, browser map showing resources:

Most of the time players do this on a second monitor, however some will have to alt-tab if they only have 1 screen to use. Though I’ve seen others use their laptops in order to do this.

Normally this is through the use of websites like mapgenie.io who offer interactive maps for 71 different games and in all of those maps they provide a LOT more detail than you can get in-game.

If we look at a game like Escape from Tarkov for example, there are no maps in-game yet these 3rd party maps show you resource locations, points of interest, extracts and a lot more useful knowledge that aid various players. They recently changed their loot so it spawns dynamically which actually made the game worse because now hackers have it even easier to find items like LEDX (high value loot) because the hacks tell them where the loot is any players don’t know the loot spawns so can’t even fight and get lucky killing a aimbotter/esper.

Maps in New World

New World’s map in game is relatively poor, it shows limited resources, locations and information that is useful to the player. For a lot of players it’s annoying, frustrating and super inefficient especially when the in-game map has lots of annoyances itself with war popups, lack of auto-zoom… etc

As such a lot of players load up websites like mapgenie to help find the resources, points of interest… etc that they are looking for.

New World Map Addons

The addons that have been produced for New World basically provide the same content (their own versions) as these websites, just in a much more useful and friendly way.

Adding and updating your location to the maps makes finding where you are on the map much easier.

All of the addons (5) that have been released for New World all feature the same core features and have had these features since their release!

The plugins have not changed to add these features, so therefore Amazon’s stance on allowing these minimaps should be allowed

  1. A minimap overlay.
  2. The reading and updating of location on the 3rd party map.
  3. Optional display/filters for resources / POI… etc

Which you can see an example of below:

Some of these addons now have a 2nd monitor version of the minimap, which is essentially a full screen minimap displaying everything the websites do/can just with the location of their character on the map. Not really that much different to a website.

Which you can see an example of below:

For reference over 150,000 (combined) people have downloaded these minimap addons, bare in mind over the last 5 days, the maximum players online at any one point was 269,000, unique players would be about 400,000~

I wouldn’t be surprised if 1/4 of those unique players (100k) are using these minimap addons, there’s a reason for that… because they’re a good tool that fixes inherent problem that the game has. Amazon don’t want to ban a quarter of their players because I’m pretty damn certain the game would spiral into a dead game real fast.

Banning Addons

A big problem New World will face if it starts banning these addons is users will simply find ways around EAC and then begins the cat and mouse game of developers wasting time trying to catch those using these addons of which the users will always be able to find a way around the anticheats.

If we look at this game, it wouldn’t take much effort from developers to read the game memory or fps counter to extract the location data and parse it into a website to achieve all of which is undetectable and achieves a similar end result.

Likewise, the use of services like TeamViewer or other remote control softwares and then the use of OCR programs to read the FPS position

If you have more and more addons/softwares trying to bypass the anticheat software it actually helps those that want to use bots and other much more serious hacks that exploit the game to the max and it becomes ridiculous.

Even Diablo 3 (Blizzard) was smart enough to not bother going after TurboHUD which was a much more powerful map/UI addon that alerted users of legendary drops, certain monsters close, showed the routes, dps counters…etc because they learned from Diablo II that if users want these tools they will find ways to beat the anticheat softwares.

Ambiguous / Unclear Statements

Amazon have put out a lot of mixed statements that are confusing, unclear and have a lot of grey areas.

Their first statement said they were in discussion, that doesn’t tell users if they can use these addons or they can’t use these addons.

Their follow up statement 14 days later after many people raised the issue with live chat, on the forums and on reddit stated that these addons were allowed but if their functionality was to change to include certain features then they would change their stance on these addons… the problem with that statement is these addons all include the features that they mentioned so it was still unclear.

That follow up caused a lot of confusion for players who made it clear on the forums that it did not make any sense.

Kay then came back and posted an update trying to clear it up but clearly hadn’t used any of the addons to actually understand what they offer because one part of Kay’s post says that they’re okay, followed up by another part saying they are not okay…

  • The addons only pull location data from the game - Allowed
  • The addons do not pull resources from the game - Allowed
  • The addons do not pull resources, nodes or places of interest from the game. - Allowed
  • The addons do pull resources, nodes, places of interest from the addons database. - ???
  • The addons do pull player made routes from a server (not a website per se) - ???

If we look at this comment from Kay:

What makes this that much different to a user going over to the likes of mapgenie and looking up the resource locations…? Should that be against the ToS?

If you ban these addons, surely i am getting a significant advantage because I have multiple monitors thus allowing me to have the resource map open on my left screen while I play on my middle screen?

If we look at [Dev Blog] Mini-map

You can’t go against addons for changing how you feel they’d affect this, if you’re not going to go against 3rd party sites like MapGenie who offer pretty much everything that these addons offer (if not more) just without the location data.

Much like how players spend days and days just farming the exact same chests… that’s some amazing gameplay, scenery and exploration… No. It’s 10x worse. No one would be staring at their minimap the whole time, let alone most of the time.

But websites can?

So how are they supposed to conform if you and Overwolf don’t have the API endpoints in place to facilitate these requirements?

What’s the current stance given that they’re not conforming?

I’ve not even got onto the fact that this developer corner post does not have any of this information posted in the announcement thread so which one is right? Update the announcement with more details, clear up that past information was incorrect and make it super clear what is and isn’t allowed.

Amazon either need to:

  • Explicitly permit the user of these tools while discussions are ongoing without the fear of being banned.

OR

  • Explicitly prohibit the use of these tools while discussions are ongoing.

Forum Moderators/Community Managers

Repeating the same thing over and over and posting snarky comments to users asking for clarifications is not acceptable and not a way to be transparent or handle this issue.

The same goes for closing threads prematurely when users clearly aren’t happy with the unclear stance.

If the permission was to change…

If Amazon were to give us permission to use these tools without fear of being banned and then after ongoing discussions they come to a conclusion of outlawing these tools then that too can be handled in a fair way fairly easily.

Amazon could update the game so anyone flagged with using these tools would see a notification every time they launch the game / login to a server that they are no longer allowed and that Amazon would start banning users who continue to use the tools after the date of dd/mm/yyyy

Announcing it on the forums only is not a fair or sufficient way of alerting users because 75% of players don’t read the forums. Also only providing 24 hours is also not a fair or sufficient way of handling such a change in stance. At minimum it needs to be 7 days notice.

47 Likes

Now this is a well written post, gg

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They stated if it shows yoru location it is ok, if it shows anythging else agaoinst TOS pretty clear…

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A website that shows locatiosn needs you to have a secodn monitor or alt tab, looking on your screen give syou advantage, Just memorize that what us old school gamers from UO and EQ did , we memorized map and locations…

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Well the new dev post is enough clear no?

https://forums.newworld.com/t/dev-blog-mini-map/

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If it was clear why would so many people disagree with you and find it unclear?

If it was that clear cut, Amazon would and should simply reply that all of these addons are prohibited and against the ToS. They’ve done zero research into them and as such are giving unclear statements.

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I hope they are working on their own, Btt map shows just where I am, ok easy… Map shows anything extra, bad …Pretty frigging simple to follow IMHO

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about as clear as mud :-
we wont punish the addons if you can change to fit these 5 rules : 4 of which are impossible until we do some more api work, which we wont commit to doing so…

does that mean they will punish those addons and users after 24h ?
perfectly clear…

and msa you put the ? in the wrong place and answered your own question.

Well the new dev post is enough clear? no

Yet what does the announcement say? The announcement is still vague, contradicts their own developer corner post.

They also mention a series of features that are currently impossible to retrieve as they have no api endpoints for tradeskills, group members… etc so technically all of the addons according to a developer corner post are against his vision of the ToS.

How are developers supposed to get that information by reading the games memory? But then that goes against their previous statement that only location data is allowed to be pulled from the game…

The point’s I’ve raised also bring light to the fact that this sort of decision just drives non-TOS friendly addons, provides advantages to players who use their browsers over these apps.

Because it’s clear to me, minimap addons are okay and tolerated as long they do not show node timer or gather information on when a node is available or not.

I do prefer to use second monitor maps but if people enjoy the minimap they are authorized.

It’s probably quite useful in town as the ingame compass does not show station and you need to open map to figure out where that kitchen station is located.

All node have the same respawn so after 300h of gameplay your starting to remember your farming route by memories so the “advantage” people claim isn’t that important.

where did you get that clear statement from ?

rule 3 states no nodes unless unlocked via tradeskills.

which contradicts your clear statement.

All node have the same respawn

i know for a fact this is incorrect pick 3 hemps of diffent sizes all at the same location and wait 15 minutes bet they dont all spawn at the same time.

the reason is was so unclear was because they literally said that overwolf was fine to use, then went on to describe what a minimap isnt allowed to do, which conveniently fit everything the addon does. and after that was questioned they came out with a “clarification” where they just repeat the same points of what is and isnt allowed instead of outright saying ‘no overwolf is not allowed’

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the minimap is ok for endgame user, with tradeskill 200. then u fix the map on 15m radius and it is ok. so for me i can use it.

not quite, they said they wont punish anyone that has used it. that doesnt mean its fine just means you got away with it.

instead of outright saying ‘no overwolf is not allowed’

they cant say that as overwolf is allowed provided all addons follow the rules - which ALL addons dont yet ( and wont unless most features are removed until the api is updated ).

ergo all addons are not ok and as we have now have an update explaining why they are not ok the 24h notification has started and thus they can now start punishing people if they choose to do so.

alas P4T this is not true :frowning: no tradeskill shows chests or poi’s or other such data and thus your addon is still against ToS even at 200 on all

then i hide other notes and chests, only for gathering mats like ore or fibers.

I don’t know, dev blog seems pretty explicit to me. Just because you don’t agree with it does not mean they are unclear.

This would simple push third party mod/addon creators to produce non-TOS friendly addons and start the whole cat and mouse game of getting around anticheats.

It would also give users who use websites on their 2nd monitor a huge advantage. I know I would simply switch to having two maps open on 2 different screens while playing the game on my main screen. I get a huge advantage over regular players, minimap players just for using a website…

i cant remember where the post is but somewhere Kay said even if its pulling that data and not showing it on the current layer it breaks ToS so again… NOPE :stuck_out_tongue:

i fear this is maybe where we are headed :frowning: all becuase some dev cant add the word LIVE :frowning: