PvE Agro / taunting needs improving

I don’t know about the ungemmed pve bit as we don’t play like that, but I can pretty much concur with everything in gemmed pve statements (lv55 tank with +200% necklace +200% weapon).

Not only do I think the necklace is broken(technically that’d be +400% aggro on all damage values, right) I also think that taunt abilities should interrupt. While this would make the game easier and remove timing from the aspect- It’s quite frustrating to force taunt a mob who continues to pursue targets away from the tank thus removing their ability to generate more aggro from damage. I have vods of this behavior tanking various dungeons and it’s quite annoying but all of that aside- Agro seems off at the moment.

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As someone playing ranged together with a sword n board player I cant say I see any issue there.
Whenever he says he used taunt it all sticks to him, but I think he mentioned switching weapons breaks the taunt buff (which would be intended I guess).

It’s very obvious from a healer perspective, either the gems are not working in armours or they’ve pre-programmed more agro on healers by default which should not be the case.

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So I’ve found out more.
Basically, do not let your dps/healers make the first action- it will mess up the aggro chain. Even if you force taunt the boss/mobs will be committed to making the first action against the first aggressor before even acknowledging the aggro. This explains why defiant stance does not rip mobs from other players and is probably the worst method of aggro in the game due to the fact that it does not deal damage which means you’re ONLY relying on the force taunt. (This is not me saying it’s a bad skill, ONLY that it’s bad for attempting to rip back aggro especially if your mages, like mine, are used to kiting things to hell and back if they have said aggro- which is fine, but as some of us know, tricky to work with.)

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Yeah,

The issue is people not knowing how to work aggro correctly. You see it all the time - healers pulling the mobs with lifestaff or archers with the bow even before the tank actually runs close enough to the mob to hit it.

Just wait a bit for the mob to attack the tank, then you’re free to go ham.

Also if the tank gets stunned and can’t attack/block for a second or two and someone else deals significat dmg in the meanwhile, mob changes aggro.

The solution for this is for the tank to have taunt on both weapons and taunt often.

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I’ve actually switched to a more damage focused build to generate more aggro. Hitting 1k seems to do the trick on a juice heavy group with just the 250% crystals(as i’m out of 300’s). I’m actually starting wonder if the aggro counter may be “infinite”. There are a few bosses in the game with very much HP that I can straight up stop messing with for a good minute if i’ve been consistently pumping for 30s.

Something to add that I have started to notice is the taunt icon above the enemies head does not stay the duration stated on the tooltip. I’ve tested a couple skills and they all drop off at 5 seconds regardless of the taunt used. I.E.:

  • Berserk: 8 seconds - drops off at 5 seconds
  • Shock Wave: 6 seconds - drops off at 5 seconds
  • Defiance Stance: 6 seconds - drops off at 5 seconds
  • Shield Bash: 6 seconds - drops off at 5 seconds

I haven’t tested the rest, but from what I’ve witness they will drop off at 5 seconds as well. Maybe this is just a visual issue, but I hope they will look into this to make sure timings aren’t off.

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Iv’e been tanking since beta and currently at lvl45. agro is unstable in this game. we only have a limited amount of taunt abilities and most times healer takes most agro. I always play a tank on mmo’s and this hurts my soul as a tank not being able to hold agro. if i have to depend on applying certain dmg them that requires me to lower my shield which i do and it gives me the terrible dps/tank vibe. pls fix this system to let the tank do it’s job otherwise whats the point of the role.

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Hi everyone,

I’ve seen a handful of posts now asking questions about how our target selection works so I’m here to answer those questions! Most of our AI select their target primarily based on “threat” which is a score that is calculated based on various actions you do. These actions include healing a player (including yourself) with a spell, dealing damage to an AI, blocking incoming damage from an AI, and using a Taunt ability. AI will generally target the player who has the most threat at any given time, and that player will have the “aggro” of the AI. While you maintain the AI’s aggro, they will target you unless any of the following happens;

  • Another player generates more threat than you and overtakes the aggro of the AI
  • Another player uses a Taunt
  • The AI uses a special ability that will target someone who does not have aggro.

Now let’s quickly run through each of these scenarios:

  • In the first scenario, if Player A has 100 threat and has aggro but Player B generates 110 threat, Player B has overtaken Player A. Player B now has aggro and the AI will target them for any attacks.
  • In the second scenario, if Player A has 100 threat and Player B has 0 threat but then uses a taunt, Player B immediately generates a little over 100 threat and takes the aggro of the creature. Player B will maintain aggro until the Taunt ends at which point the AI will default to targeting the player with the most threat. Player B better have generated more threat while the taunt was active!
    • As a quick side note, you can tell a Taunt is active by looking for the Taunt status effect icon in an AI’s nameplate.
  • In the third scenario, if Player A has 100 threat and Player B has 0 threat but a Boss uses his special ability “throw my spear at the furthest target”, Player A will have aggro but Player B will be targeted for the duration of this special ability. Once the ability ends, the Boss will resume targeting Player A. It’s important to note that Player A did not lose threat here nor did they lose aggro. Mechanics like this allow us to keep the pressure up on all players and not just the tanks.

That’s the nuts and bolts of how target selection works! Moving on to the discussion around healing, there’s been some confusion on how healing threat generation works. Healing generates significantly less threat on a per-ability basis than any other weapon. However, because Life Staff users have access to heal over times (HoTs) and area of effect heals, they’re capable of generating a good amount of threat that is consistent with other weapons. A tank with access to taunts shouldn’t have much issue regaining aggro if it is lost. One of the most frequent scenarios I’ve seen so far is that a Tank will be healed before they get a chance to deal damage to an AI so the AI will have no threat against the tank, but some threat against the healer. This tends to lead to the AI running straight for the healer.

We’re keeping a close eye on the threat generation of all of our weapons and we appreciate your feedback! I’ll see you all in Aeternum!

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Any chance you can give insight into the Jewelry perks that give taunts, and weapon gems.

Taunting I -> IV - jewelery perk doesnt allow weapons to socket non taunt gems - #2 by HanzSolo since the topics been brought up officially now.

I know theres gem rules with damage types, so just wanted a confirmation if this is intended for Taunts as well

  1. Does a HoT that is casted on the ground generate threat if it’s not healing anyone(thing)?

  2. Is there any threat reduction methods?

E.g. player A has 100 threat, B generates 110 threat. Player B should not do any actions until player A generates more threat… Unless there’s a threat dump?

  1. Does threat ever reset throughout a fight?

(Assuming boss phases changes reset threat?).

  1. Threat is always cumulative throughout a fight?

Thanks

I agree we was running depths last night every time a dps would run up never to me when I was shield bashing he would block the the ability from hitting the mod so we now we have mobs running all over the place for 25 secs because 25 sec and 50 sec was a great Ideal for cool downs on taunts

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The summoned Dogs on the 2ed to last boss in depths taunt seems to have no effect on the. Not sure if this is intended

Anyway you guys can make it to where anyone with a Carnelian Gem in their weapon just, by default, generates more threat with their attacks? If that cannot be done easily, then what about the taunting tanks ability generating more threat for X amount of time after the ability is used(If this already is the case it seems…broken somehow)? Maybe making a mechanic for all Tank skills to do a passive ‘shout’ that generates threat when a Carnelian is in the weapon? It is extremely frustrating as a tank to have to use an ability(or two) that has a CD to pull threat.

Furthermore, what about random mobs in the open world? There have been numerous times where I am farming ore, minding my own business, and another player runs past me with 10 mobs chaining on them…almost every time this has happened a chunk of the mobs have chained to me and I literally haven’t even looked at them.

Thanks for listening to the feedback.

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Agree, what they should do is be pre-programming any weapon with any type of Carnelian in it to generate more threat with ALL attacks, not just the taunting skill. I have tanked up to Dynasty(lvl 51 currently so haven’t done it yet), and I can say with certainty that I’ve never had more difficulty holding mob aggro in an MMO than I do in this game. It’s far more difficult than it needs to be especially considering positioning is all sorts of weird in this game unless your pinned against a wall.

can we get something like Change the Color from HP Bar when we are Tanking??? so often you cant see that you have the aggro or not.

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Everything described here is clear and obvious, everything works in about the same way as in any other MMORPG. However, the following happens regularly (this is especially noticeable, for example, on aligators, wolves, lynxes): you - a musketeer - make a shot at a passively standing alligator, inflicting damage on it. Another player runs past at this time.
He is closer to an alligator than a musketeer. If we consider everything as you described - then the alligator should ignore the player peacefully walking nearby and head towards the musketeer, but the following happens:
The alligator runs to the musketeer for a while, changes his mind and attacks the innocent player running past. That’s why the community asks you to deal with threat and generation.

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Could you explain what happens with targetting and leashing?
Several times now I have been peacefully fishing out of the way of any spawns, only to have someone train a bunch of mobs through the area, then the second they see me they stop chasing the person and beeline over to interrupt my fishing serenity.

It seems to me that I shouldn’t have even been on the threat table at all.

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I honestly like the current system where keeping aggro requires being active all the time and work on it. I’m playing healer on a server and tank on the other one, and I find it quite funny.

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Sometimes, when players aggro many mobs, the mobs seem to target low-level players in the immediate area (without them dealing damage). Is it possible that the health “regeneration” effect applied by food items count as a “spell”, which technically count towards threat generated by the lower-lvl player?