It also has 0 recovery frames. As in you don’t pause after it’s done like with charge, leaping strike, feral rush, skewer, etc.
In what environment should melee lose to ranged if it isn’t out in the open?
If ranged isn’t the best in that scenario then melee should also not be the best at standing on the point.
You can’t have everything. You can’t set up to stand on the point and Zerg and expect to also be the best at activities that occur outside the point.
if ranged could push in and fight on the point it would change things. But they can’t and you don’t see posts “I can’t beat melee in melee range”.
That’s the equivalent of this post.
“Please AGS give me everything. I want to stand on point, then run off the point into a field of ranged enemies and succeed. Ranged OP I can’t chase them through a field and win. As a melee players it’s not fair I have to stay on the objective behind cover where you can’t shoot me. As a melee it’s not fair I have synergy with healers, but I want to leave the healers and my cover and chase ranged in a field. Ranged OP because I can’t do this”
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Ofc they can. im always on point playing fs/ig mage. Ppl that do play bow/spear are sometimes on point to. Fact that most ppl play bow/rapier and they are usless on point is their chose. Not all range ale bad on point.
And on point mele have adventage but you can still beat them. Same should be on open - range should have advetnage but not infinite kite like now. Range should be very mobile but not infinite mobile. Range should have hard times to catch and kill range but it should be possible. Like top mele players should destroy average range players.
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Ot is posible if player smart, is not bow man problem meles use hamers and ga, swich to bb and you will cach range easy with net shot ;D
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No. You wont be able to catch bow/rapier on open space no matter what mele weapons you take. Only build that can catch bow/rapier is other bow/rapier and maybe fs/rapier.
What about GA/rapier, so much chase potential.
But no bruiser gonna play that cause it means they lose brawl power
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Its not about brawl power. Its about wasting all your cooldowns to reach a guy who’s just gonna repost and fleche away everytime you catch up. Also try chasing someone as a melee in light. You will get deleted either by a mage or another ranged guy.
Note:Melee in light without a shield
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I see all those weapons be kited by the same folks with keen speed and zephyr cakes.
and all of those leap twice as far as fleche, with feral being the exception.
I dont see it because the foundation the game is built on, wont allow it at this point. They have been trying. The last 2 weapons they released are attempting to counter life staff.
You know what else they get punished for? The ability deciding that it’s just not going to work this time. 
I played medium bruiser and still couldn’t catch them.
Someone needs to make a video of a successful backline flanker build or an assassin build that can takeout range/healers. Until we can see an updated build with PvP footage of the build in action I think it is safe to believe it is over the top difficult to kill range/healer.
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0 recovery frames is better than the distance. I’d 100% take a half as far leaping strike if it didn’t have the pause at the end.
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I think it’s been said before but the main problem currently is mostly that it’s impossible to stay in combat with a light user that just want to kite you around. Part of the problems is how some skills are just completely op at stopping people in their tracks while others are not.
For example, grav well that should be made to catch out someone, you can just get out of with a fleche or any other movement ability, but ice shower is completely imbreakable, that makes absolutely no sense.
The other one is the comparison between feral rush (normally used to root someone you are chassing) and riposte. Feral rush has tiny range so you can’t really gap close with it, on top of that you have to hit someone squarely in the back to get a root and it lasts no time at all, whereas riposte is omnidirectional stuns everyone around and the stun lasts longer.
And when you already have all of that they remove the animation cancelling of berserk, but not on the light roll? If they nerfed the light roll to not have animation cancelling that would already go a long way.
What is this “Extreme damage output” your mentioning?
Range can BARELY equal the damage a melee user does, by sacrificing all of their Con…
It takes 5-6 shits to kill a melee user, and 2-3 shots to kill a range user. The issue (As OP elegantly stated) is that when you have 2 range users facing one melee user. They each only need to land 2-3 shots to kill the melee user, which makes the matchup seem MUCH more unfair… 3 Range users and they only need to land 1-2 shots each and your Dead.
However no-one seems to be complaining when 2 melee users team up and literally Inst-kill a range user… That’s just “Deserved” for allowing them to get close…
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Shockwave > Wrecking Ball > Heavy attack (half charge)
Wrecking Ball > Heavy attack (Half charge) > Kill with PoD as they Run.
Shockwave > Heavy attack (full charge) > Kill with PoD (if not dead)
Any Hammer CC > Grav well > Bait out Riposte
Grav Well > Reap (Stagger them to guarantee 4 hits at the same time)
Literally any heavy attack on an unsuspecting light armor enemy can take out almost 1/2 their health.
The trick is to not follow one enemy too much. Find an unsuspecting light armor player. Combo them. If they survive and run, let them go and move on to the next person. You have 19 teammates and people on your team better suited for finishing off a running light armor player with 15% health (one bow shot = death).
Alot of the time you can catch someone with low health fleeing from another battle, and your combo’s can finish them off.
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My average damage as a 150con double melee(not wh/ga is like 400k-500k
As an IG/RP it’s like 500k
I got my bow level to 20 last week.
My average damage with bow/musket with 100-150con is like 800k - 1.1m a game.
False, unless it’s a 5 con musket, but we all know they’re either running away far in advance or are extremely deft with a rapier.
If the ranged user is also using a rapier. 100% their fault. Arena is the exception because there’s limited room.
I we’ve got to get over this whole “everytime someone says “melee”, they’re talking about a 200+ con GA/WH.” Thing. As if rapier/spear/hatchet/SNS don’t get used in lower con builds.
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Ice Gauntlet is not a melee weapon. Any most wouldn’t consider rapier to be either lmao (but i will for the sake of argument).
This is irrelevant. Total dmg is an incredibly skewed stat due to the MANY DoT’s and stat pads available. If you want to disucss total dmg dealt, Fire staff is SUPER OP.
This is 100% true lmao. And its obvious you know it is because you immediately deflected to rapier lol.
Beccause these are the only weapons where the matchup is unfair lol (which is fine, WH/GA has huge advantages in other situations so its fine for them to suck at range fights…duuuuh)
Spear/Hatchet/SnS/ should have absolutely 0 issue killing range users. Most people would argue that these weapons actually excel at it, and some META gamers literally claim its the only thing these weapons are good for.
Totally agree with you about IG
Rapier on the other hand(I use tondo, flourish and finish, and riposte(or evade)) certainly is.
The point was that it does a shit ton of damage. My average kills also go up when I use the bow, but this is all anecdotal. Interesting though that in my 2.1k hours I’ve played with bow for like 10 of them and my stats are better for it.
They don’t, but this is where that “extreme damage” comes into play. I’m not sure if there’s anyone that uses combination of these weapons with 200con, but it doesn’t matter if I’m in light with 8 emeralds and full shirking fort/resil or med with the same. Bows and muskets hit for a lot. A LOT. 
.
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Yep. No chance catching Light rollers in Medium armour.
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