Real reason why game is dying, and is not bugs or lag

let me understand one thing. to pvp u need strong items, right ? where will u get these strong items for pvp ? game will give u this items from npc or something like that with no money or no effort ?

wouldnt u need pve content to get the items u will need at pvp ?

Ofcorse, pvp content always will need pve content and thats the way should be, the problem is when there is only pve, and you do pve, to do more pve, to do more pve.

actually when u played pve content and then reached the final gear set/gear sets which u will use at pvp content, then will there be more pve for you at that point ?

for me, no. at that point u are at the final destination for pve. and your pvp journey begins. there is no need to play any pve content at this point when u have your final gear set u will use at pvp content.

the only thing u will need will be money for your house tax and item repairs but invasions/outpost rush will give u money to pay your house tax and repairs… u wont need to play pve at this point, or am i wrong ?

Yes we know, you know everything.

By sales figures Minecraft is the best game to have ever existed and by your logic it can never be denied.

Also Taylor Swift is the greatest artist ever and Kanye West can’t change my mind!

Mcafee is the greatest Anti Virus ever, look at how many people accidently downloaded it, can’t argue with those figures!

I “played” FF14, by play I mean I watched a bit of Asmongold READING (fantastic “gameplay” btw…), It was a great bed time story to I didn’t have to concentrate on to help me sleep!

Me: OP is wrong
Everyone else: yep

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you hit it right on.

Please list the PvP focused MMORPGs that are 20 years old and people are still playing them.

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OP is at 5 likes, what a bold statement…

Looks like you’re practicing a comment fit for youtube, I wish I could give you a like.

What end game pvp content? there is nothing to fight for, raidbosses are free pve, every important thing in the game is free pve, nobody fight for anything becouse turn off pvp and go for free, there is nothing to fight for.
Only war, a closed event… open pvp content? nothing, zero.

I think you need to brush up on your reading skills again, I never said anything about sales figure being representative of how well the game is. What I’ve said is that MMOs are a niche market and the sales figure support that, giving the income of WoW compared to income of Call of Duty. I’ve in no way or form said that sold copies indicates how good a game is.

But I give you A for effort in constructing a strawman. At least you tried.

Also as a digression; If you haven’t actually played FF14 you have no saying how that game is, simply because of lack of experience.

Lineage 2, privately, cause who wants to deal with the p2w shops, this is one of the reasons why those “PvP” games die, nothing to do with the PvP themselves.

Let’s not forget either some of the most played MMO pvp experiences, minus the “rpg”, League of Legends is one of the most played games in the world and all you do is PvP AND invest in the characters, now wait, that is something RPG related…

Let’s also remember on many discussions and reddits how the mmo genre has been dead and niche for a long time, your excuse that PvE mmo’s are still alive and breathing is pretty comical, their survival purely relies on a lack of competition AND the fact that you need to pay sub fee’s. What do lonely people do exactly other than to play WoW or FF14? they wouldn’t want to tire themselves over anything else, I assure you, these mmo’s are purely surviving from a last resort standpoint.

I’ve played FF14, I thoroughly enjoyed the lvling experience up to cap.

Then I dropped it immediately because it’s hardly an mmo, a billy basic effort, full of mini games and playing and struggling through “puzzle like” raids with no good PvP and no real open world due to it’s comical limits thanks to sticking with the PS3 tech.

LazyPeon said it best “Imagine if it’s a sequel to the Final Fantasy series, don’t see it as an MMO”.

So what? People pay the 40$, play for 3 months and that is that. This was clear from day 1. Everything is copy paste. Using a modular building system for all the buildings. Is like they went full “cheap mode” for this game. Even so, the game had a good foundation to build on. Nice graphics, interesting combat and a pleasant “old school” feeling to it.
I’m pretty sure that most of the people that already quit are doing so mostly because of the bugs and exploits. They didn’t even reach the 2-3 months you are talking about. Would of been nice to be able to do that. The game was just not ready to release. Period. They will loose a lot of players simply because of the state of the game. So many bugs present that for some the game is absolute unplayable. I am one of those. Since 10 days I’m haunted by the “item at another post/action throttled/reload/reset/desync” glitch. After 10 days absolute no response from their side. 10 days me and hundreds of players can’t play the game we payed for.
There is no support or customer service what so ever.
So maybe you are 100% right on the long term. But right now, everyone that is leaving have a lot of fights with their “trillions” of bugs. So many that some of us can’t play the game. Period. They will keep loosing players. Did they not test the game before? Is this the biggest “western release scam” or what? What point of having great pvp, great pve, honor system and all the features you mentioned if no one can use them? Because they are all bugged :)).


lol you clearly dont know your history Orram. all PvE games focus fail. PvErs living in their own world

LOL, this is such a hot take. Sorry, pal, but your PvP playerbase is a minority of the MMO community. They’d just as well play a dozen other games with no persistent world or RPG elements.

Look at the PvP in FFXIV. It’s almost an afterthought. Yet, somehow, their playerbase has grown massively since the launch of 2.0. Now look at their message on delaying the launch of their expansion and how the 99% PvE population responds to that.

PvE players need an engaging content loop. AGS gated everything behind tediousness. If you want to do anything interesting in New World there is a boredom tax to pay. Some of that is the lack of content that all young MMO suffer from. Most of it, though, is design flaws, bugs, and disabled content. The already meager feeling of progression disappears at 60. There is no joy in end game, only dogged determination to power through the tedium to gear up for ???

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Look at the PvP in FFXIV. It’s almost an afterthought. Yet, somehow, their playerbase has grown massively since the launch of 2.0. Now look at their message on delaying the launch of their expansion and how the 99% PvE population responds to that.

“Somehow”, mate, WoW has made a mockery of their playerbase for so long a huge herd of them flocked over to their rival xD

yes i didnt say there is enough pvp content actually. whats why i am writing that for a few days.

people quit until now quit cuz ;

1- the group which came from streamers/youtubers with hypetrain
2- the group which saw ags’s amateur dev team after that much bugs exploits dupe situations
3- the group including some few 60 level which saw there is NO END GAME CONTENT.

but the big part of the people didnt reach their final destination yet. (Lv 60 with a good gear set).

when they reach this, that group will be the 4th group which will quit the game.

so the people quit after now will be probably the people which reach 60 level and maybe a good gear set and see the truth and start asking themselves “WHERE IS THE CONTENT, I GAVE EFFORT TO BE LEVEL 60, I Gave The Effort For That Gear Set, and FOR WHAT ? FOR THIS ?”.

cuz exploits bugs dupes even couldnt make them quit. but lack of content, that will make them quit.

There is a weird thing like that.

Q: Why u are playing pve ?
A: To make a good armor set and weapon
Q: What will u make with that good armor set and weapon
A: PVP Content
Q: Is there enough pvp content ?
A : No
Q: So why will u play all this Pve Content at first place ?
A: …

when u realize that situation. It is The End.


no they dont.

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They’ve been accumulating players for 8 years. The numbers have consistently gone up year over year. The point being, PvE players don’t just get bored and move on. The core issue causing NW to lose players has to do with their design and implementation, not the mentality of PvE players.

well lets take a closer look at your little list there based on polls the games themselves have run on PVP

Black desert 7 years old game - 9% of players considered themselves PVP
RuneScape 20 years old game - 4% of players PVP
MapleStory 18 years old game - 12% pvp
lineage 2, 20 years old game - 8% pvp
Ragnarok online 19 years old game - 16% hardcore pvp
Dragon nest 11 years old game - 11% hardcore pvp

These percentages come from polls of their own players these games have done. Your own list proves PVE is what carries those games not PVP. It they lost the PvE players they would shut down, if they lost the pvp players it would have minimal impact as there are still enough PvE players to keep them alive.

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