[SUGGESTION] The "Re-Forging" System - How New World can tie its End Game systems together

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16

I have concerns with your system and assumptions.

Azoth was just ONE of the aspects here. I dont think it costing 1,000 Azoth for ONE reroll would be cheap at all, especially combined with my suggestion of Repair KITS as well, which are 300 per kit. If it took even 10 repair kits, you are talking 3,000 repair parts to reroll ONE perk that would have like a 1-2% chance of hitting a desired perk…

Azoth TODAY is so cheap, because we dont have anything to spend it on. It was not long ago Azoth Vials were 100g a pop. So 1,000 azoth for 1 re-roll would run you 2k gold as well as the 10 repair kits which I could easily also see going for 100g+ a pop, so now 4k gold for 1 re-roll. Then factor in the % FAILURE chance, and the Daily/weekly COOLDOWN on doing this, it will in no way be “Too Easy to come by”.

As for UMBRAL Shards, the problem there is Umbral are not tradable. Literally right above your comment, Rochadura commented:

Your system forces crafters into PVE, especially at high mutation levels to get said umbral. I dont think we need to involve UMBRAL into this system. Using Umbral also doesnt address any of the other end game systems as I mentioned in this post.

My system involves repair kits, azoth, and Charms/Mods. It would massively improve the value of mods from chests, from the TONS of crappy gear we get, which we now NEED for the repair parts…

Your suggestion doesnt solve any of that, and just pushes people more and more into mutations as the only way of getting BIS.

17

Yes, But we aren’t trading Umbral Shards. This is why Crafters will be valued more. They have to farm for the Shards Via OPR, Gypsum Casts, Mutations.

They aren’t forced to do Mutations as they can get that through Gypsum casts by the Thousands.

18

Assuming they are 600 Expertise in their items. Many crafters who are PURE crafters dont want to do a 20-30min OPR, or ARENT 600 Expertise… Also what system do you propose in place to determine “Max Crafters”. Nearly everyone I know is a “Max Crafters” in the sense they have 200 skill.

The REAL “Max Crafters” in my book are the ones who have 6/6 Gear pieces as well as 3x Major trophies.

Having this tied to Umbral Shards really does nothing to address any of the other issues. It feels like a duct tape option where as it could have far reaching impacts, to boost other areas of the game. Azoth, Repair Parts/Kits, and Crafting Mods.

Having some “life” breathed into OTHER areas of the game, such as Portals, Elite Zone runs, etc. Can keep those activities alive. Once a server stops getting new players, and those existing players get their GS up above 600, people will just stop doing most open world stuff. Will stop doing Elite Zones, Portals, etc.

Why not put some value back into those activities? Portals? Yeah, we need the Azoth for reforging gear. Elite Chest Runs? Yeah we need the repair parts and crafting mods for re-rolling gear. All the crappy gear pieces we get from doing mutations? Yeah, we need the repair parts for re-rolling gear. Etc.

Leave Umbral for upgrading GS. We dont need more “Umbral Sinks”. We DO need sinks for other items in the game, that we currently dont really have (Azoth, Repair Parts/Kits, Un-wanted Mods).

19

If you consider someone who logs in and does nothing but crafting, That isn’t a Real Crafter. A Real Crafter is as you have stated.

This would be overcome if they removed the CD on crafting Tuning Orbs because everyone / Crafters, would be out farming materials to craft the orbs and sell them.

Would be fixed if the CDs on Crafting Orbs were removed.

Azoth can be placed in the Town Boards to help upgrade certain things in the Settlement.

This could be broken down for actual mats instead of repair parts. Repair parts are meaning less in the game at the moment and need to be removed.

At the moment, you are correct. After the next update, you can almost get 4,000 Shards a day from Gypsum Casts alone.
We will need Umbral Shard sinks then.

20

Very good idea, but there’s a long line of good idea for AGS and none yet was implemented

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21

Good Idea. But maybe let crafters create a specific kit to remove an buff and apply a new random one. They can then sell these on the marketplace or directly without needing Bind on Pickup or Bound items having to be traded?

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22

Well that’s part of the restriction, cant do this with BOP items or if you want to, you need to do it yourself.

It’s primarily a system to recycle repair parts/kits as well as azoth sink.

People are already very worried a path like this makes it too easy for BIS gear, so BOP gear can’t be traded to a crafter to reroll

23

I think this is a great idea that is well thought out and would make BiS gear appear more accessible for the average player, without making it too accessible. The one thing I would change is do not require tradeskills to do this. This game already has too many grinds that make good parts of the game inaccessible to many players. Balance the repair parts cost so it’s not “too good” and let everyone do it, and that way everyone will be happier :slight_smile:

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24

yea I agree

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25

Thanks, I feel like it strikes a good balance between cost, time, etc as well as ties in the other aspects of end game. I ran some M9s last night and got like 100 useless items… Basically just repair parts and a few gold. So would feel much better being able to use those for something.

I do feel like this needs to be tied to tradeskills as it adds more relevance to them. Right now, there really is no reason to get Major Profession Trophies, considering the difference between a 590 craft and 598 craft is just a little Umbral Shards… So why spend 30k or 50k on a trophy to bump your GS craft up +1 or +2 when you can run 1 Mutation instead and get all the umbral you need to make that difference?

I feel including this system with professions really gives BIG incentive to either get those professions up yourself, or know someone who has them, who can do this for you.

26

100% We need a system around this type. The disparity between a usable PVP setup and a entry level setup is huge. Further the likely hood you’ll get full BiS is essentially 0.

I’ve been playing for 2k+ Hours, the best I’ve managed is BiS weapons (named drops) and only 1 true bis random piece for my build
(Refreshing Evasion + Resil + weapon perk) This piece was extremely expensive, but money isn’t the problem… I have a ton of coin! The issue is that these gear pieces never get created in the first place.

27

A major thing I would change . . .

Take it out of the hands of armor/weaponsmiths. You kind of have to. Why? The BOP component. I have had some interesting leggos drop that are NOT named but BOP.

So how do we solve this? The solution is kinda already in game! The gypsum kiln. Imagine going to the kiln. You choose the armor/weapon that you want to reroll. You put in the weapon/armor you want to reroll. You pay in umbral shard currency. But wait . . . you can now get some form of a timeless shard item that will let you reroll. Those shards are farmable, drop from expeditions, etc. The kiln already has the code in it for cooldowns per slot.

Why am I trying to get away from crafters? Because small servers may not have buffs running, tables up, etc. This method, imo, is more inclusive.

28

I hear you, but I dont think we should remove it from crafters. Town Buffs only account for a small 5%. Most of your % will come from 6/6 Gear + Trophies, Food, etc.

Getting the ability to re-forge gear, is going to mean the difference between like a 20k item, and 300k item. I mean getting like some Resilient + Refreshing Evasion + Beast Ward item, and being able to re-roll that and possibly landing on an ability perk? Thats a “God Roll” and should have some drastic ramifications.

I really think this strikes a fair balance. If you have BOP gear, and upgrade it yourself… I mean heck even with my EXACT proposal %s, just throwing on the food alone would take you from 30% to 45% success rate. Pick up some MINOR trophies, and I believe thats another 9%?

So with very minimal investment, no town buffs, no armor gear, no greater trophies. An “Average Joe” could have a 50%+ chance of success at 10 attempts/day in re-forging the gear.

Right now, nobody really gets excited to be a crafter, or to know a crafter with 3x Majors, etc.

Not only does the “average joe” have their own 10x daily CDs you could use on BOP gear, but if you happen to have some nice BOE gear and want to re-roll, you can pay or give your “bro” who is a maxed crafter the mats, to have a higher chance of success and not waste your mats…

I feel it strikes a very fair balance between “expert” and “average Joe” as well as BOP vs BOE, as well as the “Cost” of Repair Kits + Azoth, etc.

Costing Umbral doesnt really do anything to the “economy” other than makes Mutations even more necessary… Why? If it only costs 100 Umbral per re-forge I can do a few M9/10s and with just that Umbral likely get a “God-Roll” item. Too easy.

If it costs 1000 Umbral. Now people are forced back into running M9/10s and not being able to play the way they want, etc.

The FOCUS here, was not just on having a system to Re-forge, but also having crafters be involved, azoth, repair kits, etc. all to “Sync” together all the end game systems we already have.

29

But players will complain about the time gate like they complained about keys to get into the dungeon.

They will complain about the dungeon and about the few quantity of reforge and if you give to them unlimited dungeons runs and decrease its rewards try avoiding devaluation of items and economy they will complain again.

30

Too many layers of RNG are currently in the game. It’s not fun, it’s not rewarding.

Take a look at loot 2.0 in diablo 3.

31

i can only get behind this IF 1 perk can be re rolled ONLY

like once you “pick the original rerolled perk” you can only reroll THAT perk.

it should NEVER be a FULL reroll system, where we can “craft BIS” with enough RErolls… because dropped gear is pointless at that point…

32

I hear ya, Im not quite sure if thats true or not. I mean you wouldnt take like some Beastward + Corrupted Resist piece of gear and start re-rolling it for perks.

Ill point out, I DIDNT include the ability to re-roll STATS, just Perks. So if you think about that, to get an item worth re-rolling it would take the right weight of the item, with the right stats, and 1 of 2 perks you want. You would then need to re-roll the other perk probably 50-100 times, which could take you like 2+ weeks of re-rolling that ONE item, to get a 2 perk item.

I can forsee the new “meta” of making gear, focusing on trying to find a Legendary item, with the right weight, stats, and ONE perk that matches what you want (like Resilient) and then starting the long journey of re-rolling the 2nd perk, and then the 3rd, etc.

Did any of that invalidate the loot? I dont know. You had to find/drop a Legendary item, that has the right weight, stats, perk to start rolling.

Again, considering AGS has total control over the “cost” levers here… I mean shoot, lets say just ONE re-forge costs 1000 Azoth and 10 Repair Kits… Its going to take you a LONG time (and money) to re-forge just ONE stat on ONE piece of gear.

I am with you in that I dont think the path to getting a 3 perk legendary should be attainable that easily. I think between not allowing the STATS to re-roll. Not allowing the WEIGHT of the armor to re-roll (obviously). Balancing the proper Azoth/Repair Kit cost and maybe any sort of “Cooldown” on the process… It definitely would not be easy to get a 3 perk item you are after… It might take you literally weeks and weeks to get 1 “BIS” piece at that point.

33

you lack the foresight of the economy driven game ??.. vials of zoth are tradable with enough cash you can just buy all the zoth you want, and since some company’s that own windsward ect have max money on all there players, price point does not matter to them. or you just spam gathering trade skills and gain both vials/tools with zoth on gather, or corruption portals… ect… to many ways to refill zoth with enough motivation, so this is a invalid consumable, it only limits the casual… and repair parts can be bought/created VERY SUPER EASY… you just make iron 2handed weapon and salvage for 12 parts ?? duh) the Cool down is your only limiting factor here… and its not enough…

my previous remake on your idea (a great idea i like 80 % of it, and just adding some feedback/thoughts on how to improve it IMO) the “1 perk slot” at best can be rerolled unlimitedly, has to be accepted with your idea, because otherwise crafting is just holding on to “decent” items that you RNG spam for weeks (daily login for CD uses are LAME and it drives a play for 5 minute a day then log off mentality)

with my idea, it gives a drive to find / craft these items, otherwise it becomes like Path of exile… all you need is the best “base” (blank rolled item) to just “mod till your happy” making our gear ALL custom rolled… its a bad idea. imo

the better option for your craft idea …

let us upgrade 2perk purples with a RANDOM (never per-determined) to 600 triple perk’ers
limited by CD for crafters… and maybe even making them BOP after upgrading…

it would make EVERYONE want to craft again… for new players to level crafting (as most don’t anymore cause you can get ANY crafting done with a simple shout out in global)

it would validate the 590+ 2 godly perk items to being the new “market hot item” to buy / and bump for a random chance once you push to 600 to become 3 perfect perked, and giving crafters a away to make money on there skills post end game

i agree RNG system now is unforgiving, brutal, anti casual gamer, anti-fun even

34

Hey Cheers for the discussion and thanks for the input.

I agree, the cost vs reward needs a balance. I am not opposed to them locking the ability to re-roll to just ONE perk on the item. That would require you to get a “near-miss” or whatever, where the item has like 3/4 or 4/5 aspects you are looking for, and is off in just 1 area, and this system allows you to address that 1 area and get it to where you want it to be.

I agree that Azoth is dirt cheap, however, I think if there were a reason to spend Azoth, you would see Vials grow in price again. I am not opposed to making 1 “re-roll” attempt cost 1,000 Azoth. The more we discuss this, the more I think 1,000 Azoth should be the cost of 1 attempt at a re-roll.

As for repair parts, yes - you can make an Iron 2H Weapon and salvage for repair parts. So maybe that requires some revision. Crafted weapons already provide you back some of the mats to craft, maybe they shouldnt provide ANY repair parts, so you cannot skirt around repair parts in this system for the repair kits. So this would mean only actual DROPPED gear provides repair parts for kits, which now creates an economy/market for almost every single dropped part in the game. I can easily see a world in which every player is constantly making repair kits to sell since they would be in high demand. Which I think helps the economy out, as this starts spreading the wealth around from the rich companies, to the average players as you are right, the rich companies will be going to the market and just buying all the mats needed. Repair Kits, Azoth, Mods, etc.

This is where the more I think about it, the more this “re-forge” system DOES need a CD. I agree a daily CD is lame, and why I think a WEEKLY CD would probably be the best approach, mixed with all the above.

If an “average 200 armorer” with no trophies, no gear, etc. Has only 10 attempts/week and is likely to FAIL 3-5 of those attempts, thats a massive cost.

This encourages people (as you said) to level armoring, to acquire the Major trophies, etc. For a higher chance of success.

So I think its all there, and doing 1,000 Azoth per re-forge. Removing Repair parts from crafting gear. Having it a 10/week CD, with the chance to fail system. All balances this out.

The Weekly CD makes it so companies cannot just “buy” their way immediately. It increases the value of the best crafters, and encourages everyone to level again.

If you want to take it a step FURTHER and restrict the re-forge to 1 “perk slot” on an item, I am fine with it 100%, but I am also worries AGS doesnt have the ability/code ability to do that easily. I dont know their limitations, so I didnt suggest that upfront.

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35

To be absolutely fair… they dont care anyway.

its not like they arent the ones buying up all the asmo cool downs and burning rolls.

this isnt an issue with the economy it self.

its an issue with how ridiculous territory control is. (some territories)

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