It’s becoming extremely common to see people dishing out 3k to 4k per hit, whilest only taking 300 damage from a pure DPS. That isn’t skill based combat, thats just broken and extremely disheartening to play any class other than a melee tank. Its literally impossible for anyone to take that down 1 vs 1. Its just as bad as Life Staffers, except they don’t do too much damage, they are just impossible to kill if they have even half a brain. It doesn’t matter if this game was sold as skill based pvp or not…that’s frustrating for everyone.
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haven’t really seen a tank dps, anyone with really high con + heavy armor will have garbage dps. lifestaffers are far worse.
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Glass cannon DPSers who can’t survive when a fluffy bunny looks at them sideways are the worst. And then they cry on forums. Here’s the key: When you’re DEAD, your DPS is 0.
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The game has no classes . If one wants to commit to swordmaster and DPS they are doing sonar the cost of mitigation
Weapons and skill trees are diverse people shouldn’t be pigeonholed.
Anyone can carry a lifestaff or void guantlet and heal it doesn’t make them have to okay within your stereotyped archetype.
Not officially, but if you measure what a class is, to what weapons are, you will find this game does in fact have classes.
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And each weapon had two skill trees.
Sword can go DPS or it can go defense.
Hatchet can go DPS or it can go cc
Musket can go DPS or it can go cc
Rapier can go offense or defense
Etc
And of course all the skill trees have hybrid options
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I do about 2k damage as a glass cannon dps…whilest getting 1 hit by a melee user who does 4-6k damage…Thats not crying, thats an obvious problem lol
yeah but if we’re alive our dps is 9000, just kidding
I agree that heavy armor and GA/WH specifically is a problem in this game. I’ve played almost every class and maxed out my weapon mastery in each. What I have noticed is that the WH/GA DMG multiplier is broken. Some light attacks will hit for 500 damage, while some will crit for over 5k+. The fact is that a player with gap closers using this combination will more than likely come out on top for 1 simple reason: CC. In any game I’ve ever played CC is king no matter what.
If you can CC someone, they are good as dead. WH/GA together have an insane gap closing and CC chain. Now couple it with max damage resistance and max damage output. You can guess the outcome. The problem is that other classes feel lackluster in comparison bc you wont find that ez clap kill your looking for, bc they can’t counter the combination that’s in front of them. Ik for a fact that the rapier class, although very strong and can output high DPS (damage per second) which is different than “single hit damage”. PVE rapier is god tier, but PVP it falls slightly short, bc in reality u’ll never be able to hit more than 1 or 2 times without trading damage, and for squishy high DPS players, thats fatal. In general its a game flaw, that allows such an absurd combination of weapons and armor.
Very well thought out, thank you. I hope it gets resolved at some point, because for me melee is just an overall boring play style. I LOVE my IG/FS because its just so much fun, but its not fun getting constantly clapped in one hit haha
Are we playing the same game? Wasn’t aware that the hatchet and musket had crowd crontrol talents. Can you show me where those are?
Rend slow and disease well technically two debuffs and one cc tool
that’s not a crowd control, unlike the war hammer where you can aoe stun and flatten several players
I don’t understand your argument
Slow is definitely a form of crowd control, as is root.
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I would not be so quick to do that.
With years of experience on wow’s balance team, i can tell you there is bigger problems at play here, ones that will require a lot more work to really be solved.
Tree’s at face value need to be more complex. here is a post i made about some options to improve that
I would also like to deposit the position of making various abilities have “levels” where you place 3 skill points into them to get different effects, rather than transition to another talent, than another.
If the system designers want, i will make a high fidelity really flushed out example of this (i may even do it just for fun tonight for downtime).
Second,
There are some issues in the talent tree itself out side of the talent tree’s native mechanical design. Taking bow for example, with many 20% bonus’s, and its natural weakness at lower to mid levels, there seems to be huge amounts of instability in the talent tree.
This is because prior to level 45, the bow is “undertuned”, and granted some of that problem may be attributed to the fact that ammo is not working correctly, but after this rate the talent tree and weapon seem to grow in power in a way that is not healthy, and ultimately leads to breaking the game with 13,000 damage4.
My fear is that there is a lot of potential here for thse talent trees, however, that will never be realized in any near-mid future if “good enough” happens to weapons.
Next, I would also like to suggest that we should look into shifting talents away from +damage %, and move them more in the direction of “faster charging heavy weapons”. Use mechanics to buff damage, not grant raw damage.
In the interest of reducing work-load and dev hours on classes, it would be highly important for one of the system designers to read this point and understand the point of “power in == instability (lack of balance) out of the game”. The more +x% of power buffs we have, the more difficult the game will become, and the more “broken” things will be. A key point that new designers need to learn when working on class balance. The key is to depend on mechanical operation and variance to make weapons feel unique, instead of power (ie statistical values)
So just rushing off to the system designers about these things may not be a good idea when it comes to adjustments. Now we come to a more problematic topic, which is “should tanks do damge” in this game. The answer is, it depends on what kit the tanks have; However, I have a very interesting solution that may not of been considered by many.
Maybe the system designers should look at shifting the sword/board and similar future tank weapons off of strength, and onto constituion.
This way, they can obtain more damage and at the same time be built for large hp pulls and tanking but not have equal level damage to actual damage dealers, solving two problems with one stone.
A lot of the talent tree can be cleaned up also by doing things like
and then just showing the 1/3 ect part on mouse over @ mouse position
This should be a better mockup. This put all the concepts above into a simple 10 second “study” picture
you will notice, while these tree’s are not complete, they dont have things like +20% Damage. Instead we see damage increases by the mechanics (50% Faster light attacks, or heavy charge).
These mechanical changes will better suit different situations, and different play styles adding huge amounts of depth to the “feel” of weapons due to improved functionality.
Slow, knockback, root, etc. are all CC. If you can “control” one enemy or multiple, it’s CC. Trapper for Musket and Crowd Crusher for Warhammer are both CC trees. To clarify, the Social Distancing skill for Hatchet is a CC skill, not a tree. I’m not sure if you have the correct definition of crowd control.
“Crowd control (also called CC) is a term used in MMORPGs (Massive Multiplayer Online Role-Playing Games) and MOBAs (Multiplayer Online Battle Arenas) to refer to the ability to partially or completely disable one or more players or mobs, hence limiting the number of opponents actively fighting during an encounter.”
thanks for the clarification boss, carry on with your New World experience
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