Unjust ban: your ban system is not working as intended

I honestly never thought I would be posting on these forums with a complaint. From day one, I have been giving AGS the benefit of the doubt saying that too much pressure has been placed on them as a relatetively new studio and that the [BRUTAL] amount of bugs and issues with the game is simply a learning process for a game with huge potential. Me and a close group of friends have stuck with this game since open Beta, playing multiple hours through thick (closed trading posts, unplayable levels of desync, overpowered builds, abilities that dony work as intended, etc., etc., etc…) and thin (the combat and game feel is great when it works, player interation is great, etc…). However, AGS said “this is not enough… they are unaffected by our ruse… we must punish them more”. And thus, for no discernable reason what-so-ever, my buddy was permenantly banned in the middle of a pvp gaming session for cheating.

Now there are a few parts to this that really make me angry. Ill preface by saying I spent a good couple of hours reading similar issues on the forums and some of my assumptions here (like the way he was banned being from easy-anti-cheat) are from those readings.

The first is that my friend has absolutely no reason to cheat.
A) He has over gold cap and is keeping his extra in his own guild storage so he has over 800k (im just going by the last screenshot he posted a little while ago). He earned this by farming some and working the trading post every day since release, and general gains from playing the game like trophy mat drops. He has close to bis on all his pieces and has no reason to spend any money there. So his money situation is great. He is good at pvp, regularly getting first place in OPRs and and hold his own in open world PVP. And lastly, he only plays to play with us 5 so theres no external competition in the game that would drive him to cheat.
B) he has no reason to lie to us about cheating. We have been close friends for years now playing many games and cheating has never been part of gaming for us. We are all above 30 years old and play for the leisure and social aspect. Lying about cheating wouldnt do anything for him here… in fact i would go so far to assume that if he was cheating, he would not only tell us, but we would all probably share a laugh when he got banned.
C) other than open world pvp, we dont really do much in the game. We play specifically to cature forts, find enemy groups doing chest runs, and the odd OPR game. We have played for so long that there is no real intrinsic gain for us other than the fun we get from facing a pvp challenge. But that fun wouldnt exists with cheating so why would he?
So with that all said, its clear to me that the fault is on AGS using automated anticheating software that is KNOWN to detect harmless programs (like PC fan control software). Sick!

The second reason is that we have been reporting known bots throughout our… 3 or 4 servers now (thanks to the constant merges) and some of these guys are STILL IN THE GAME THROUGH MULTIPLE SERVER MERGES! I have personally reported a bot 10-15 times at least, everytime i see him and my friends do the same. He is actually well known as a bot throughout the server. I just saw him farming orichalcum a week ago… I HAVE BEEM REPORTING THIS GUY FOR LIKE 5 MONTHS… The same is true for a number of other bots in the game as well. I specifically know of people in guilds on our server that use exploits to gain advantages in wars and nothing has ever happened to these guys other than the odd 1-2 day slap on the wrist ban. But no. Permenanty ban the guy who wasnt cheating. Nice work AGS! Your sadistic system is working as intended

The third thing that drives me nuts about this is the complete lack of transparency on the ban. The way the ban happened was my two friends were capturing a fort when my banned friend was suddenly disconnected. He then tried to log back in and was given a ban message. He immediately tried to appeal the ban and went through the ban appeal process. Not even 5 minutes later he received a (clearly) copy and pasted message about the terms and conditions and told the ban is not being lifted. WE HAVE NO IDEA WHY. We are all sitting here on our hands, unable to do anything about it because the whole process is automated! What in the world! What a way to show you appreciate your player base… its so frustrating to see 1000s of hours of legit play go to waste because AGS just doesnt give a flying rat about us…

And this brings me to the final issue i have with this system. Why on earth does an automatic ban system have the ability to permenantly ban an account on the first ban? Why would it have this? Especially since there are known issues with other harmless software? Also why would it just default to “your account is never able to be played again”? No warning, no nothing. Even if my friend WAS cheating, why would he not receive a warning like a 2-3 day, or even 1-2 week ban as a “hey dont do that again”? Instead, a broken, automated software with known issues is able to permanently ban someone, zero disclosed reasons (as stated above), and is paired by a copy/paste appeal system with zero additional information about the ban.

You have FINALLY showed us how little you care about your player base. You did it! You finally ruined the game for us and it wasnt even our choice. We wanted to keep playing this game despite all its querks and faults because we still found it enjoyable. But now you literally give my friend no choice but to stop and, out of principal (and desire to play with our friend group) we’re all moving on to something different. Thanks for nothing AGS, please PLEASE take a good look at your ban system and stop kicking people when they are already down. Good lord what a waste of 8 months.

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Honestly posting here won’t really do much and we don’t really have the full context here. It very well could be that they were unjustly banned but when we see these posts on the forums we just see one side of this. They easily could have been selling their gold on the side, recently abusing the attribute bug, consistently an asshole leading to an eventual permanent ban, or a ton other things. There best thing you can do is just appeal it. Although, these things typically go the way of, “they never would do something like that…” until you learn they did.

Not to say they have not banned people inappropriately before because they have, they mentioned this in the dev videos. It’s just not gonna help you here because AGS won’t discuss ban stuff on here from my experience and you just opening yourself up to people telling you that they probably deserved it. Be patient, if it’s legit, the appeal will go through.

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I have an update for this which just further shows the total disrespect how how broken this system is. Im posting this for anyone who has gotten wrongfully banned and being told they are lying so you know youre not crazy.

I ended up chatting with my friend this morning and he gave me some of the screenshots he took of the whole process and its honestly laughable.

To recap slightly, he was capturing a fort with my friend when he game froze and the game kicked him out with a message saying “corrupted files”. When he tried to log back in, he got a message saying “you have been permenantly banned for cheating” so he immediately clicked the appeal option because he didnt know what was going on.

Cue the first screenshot of his account on the appeal site saying he was only banned until may 2nd. This is the first incidence of a mismatch with this system. He was still banned on may 3rd so obviously that is not true.
unknown

So he continues to appeal the ban, spends about 30 minutes writing a thoughtful, spell checked response with screenshots showing what happened. After 2-3 minutes he receives a copy-pasted response from AGS with the next mismatch in this system (see the red highlight).

The best part about this is that he hasnt had lost ark installed for months. He said he downloaded it the week it came out, and then he uninstalled it a few hours later when he realised it didnt like the game. Sooooo…

So basically, 3 levels of mismatched information, and the resultant “appeal” notice giving absolutely no further information or clarification on the subject. Im assuming that anybody who can read can see the complete failure of this system to work properly, and the increasing amount of player complaints appearing on the forums for unjust bans should be further evidence that this is not working as intended. I dont know what the full steps to rectify these issues are, but i do know that the next step here is for AGS to stop insinuating that these players are lying and to immediately accept that the appeal system IS NOT WORKING AS INTENDED - as most would assume, a copy-past/automated system likely would not work as intended!

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Well 99% of players who got band earn it. But fact is support is lowest quality. In fact no support wold be same quality as ags support right now.

Thanks for the thoughtful response, I appreciate it. I want to clarify im not here asking for an appeal. My friend has already cancelled amazon prime and other amazon related things he pays for and uninstalled new world. The bottom line is, simply put, we dont have time for this. We all have careers, significant others, and some of us kids as well. We dont have time to keep appealing wrongful permenant bans on games we have sunk (probably too much) time into. This is supposed to be our leisure time!

I also want to stress that the approach you are speaking of is called a guilty-untill-proven-innocent approach. The whole thing is built on automatically banning someone and then making them put the time and effort into proving their innocence. Its completely backwards. I also caution against using the approach even when perusing the forums because it will lead to labeling honest customers/players as guilty of cheating/lying as opposed to giving these people the benefit of the doubt. The foundation of our society has been built on the standard of innocent-until-proven-guilty so that innocent people don’t get wrongfully punished. It might not be perfect, but if its good enough for the court systems of the world, it should be good enough for amazon games studios.

I got an update about 30 minutes ago (screenshot below). After our chat he tried again to appeal because I told him about my readings in the forums. Within minutes he received the same email i posted above, except this time it said new world instead of lost ark. So I guess thats it!

*Edited to include screenshot

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Yep I dont disagree. Obviosuly we dont know the actual stats, but even if it was 99%, thats still 1% of legit players getting wrongfully banned with garbage support for them.

Its a slippery slope as the playerbase is already super diminished. Those who are still playing are likely doing so because they have friends that still play. For each wrongful ban, you are likely to knock out a few other legit players as well as their friends migrate to different games.

But hey, ultimately its AGS’s grave and they are digging it themselves. It issss what it isssss

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first it’s banned not band, this is not a musical lol secondly I was banned for 6 hours and after the ban, I kept complaining about it HERE and I DID get results…come to find out a GM logged into my account, blocked me so they could see my issue then kept the ban on only to find out it was by ‘mistake’ and in a week I’ll get an OPR reward which I said I do not pvp so that does me no good. So either I’m the “1%” or you’re way off…you’re way off. I am no longer ‘banned’ and it was all thanks to me appealing the ban getting the auto-response ‘Code of Conduct’ violation and after the 6 hour ban without transparency and I DID complain here and DID get results. The auto-ban system they have in place is a joke gold sellers and bots laugh at while real players to trying to enjoy this p.o.s. game bc we see the potential if ASG would replace the devs and give more power to the CM’s on forums instead of “We’ll pass this along” (Which btw they said that and DID follow through leading to the explanation as to why I was banned. So, @Deadjimmy I feel for you and your crew man, I’m sorry to see good players leave because of how inept some people and companies are

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ye not true… got banned aswell for 4 days first ( for some reason it was 3 )
support just said cheating, which i never did <.<

1350 hours… pre ordered aswell
250/300 euro in cashshop

and they wont answer or show any proof

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Does not matter how much hours u playd or euro u spent. If you cheat you cheat lol.
And they dont show you proof as any other support in any other game. Dunno why but maybe it law related? Dunno.

Fact is most ppl crying about ban deserve it.

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what a retarded answer :smiley:
cant wait till u get a ban for no reason

I had 7 days ban but i earn it. I just play online games for like 20 years so i know how “unjust bans” are unjust. Ppl do behave like they are alone playing the game and then they lie to friend about bans they didnt deserve.

This is the response I received from ASG after I reached out here…

Hello! I’m so sorry this happened to you! We investigated this and found out that one of our GMs placed that temporary lock to investigate an issue with your account. We do apologize the anxiety you must have gone through when you realised you were banned! Please be assured that you are not penalized for any wrong actions.

To compensate the time not being able to play while you’re locked out, one of our GMs will leave an OPR cache in your inventory sometime within the week while you’re offline.

Once again, so sorry about this! We hope you’ll continue to enjoy your time in Aeternum!

So again, you’re WAY off

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14 years for me, but when people have a report system ( just as example League of Legends)

they abuse it :slight_smile:
hit 5million dmg in an invasion, when rest has below 2.3million… > pretty sure i recieve a few :thinking:

20 years…not bad not bad, I was playing the Atari 2600 when it first came out and always been a gamer, so 20 years of online games…I still remember the Legends of Future Past mmo back in the early 90’s, but 20 years…not bad

I appreciate you admiting to earning your ban. However, I still dont understand why people like yourself are on this forum openly admiting to earning a ban and you only receive a 7 day ban. Then you have my friend who has done nothing and receives a permanent ban. No more use of his account, 1500+ hours wasted for absolutely no reason other than devs using lazy, automated systems that dont work properly.

I really believe this needs to be emphasized. While its 100% unfair for @Tovic43 and @Vesstan to receive unjust bans, they still have use of their account after the ban period. Theres no excuse for this and I am not trying to downplay their situation at all because its WRONG that they had to go through that for no reason. But real talk… my friend is stright up never allowed to use his account again. 1500+ hours, learning, grinding, earning, all GONE forever because easy-anticheat is broken. Real sad to see here and also sad to see others in similar boats across this forum.

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Well there is bug since release day. Each ban after some period of time is visible as “perma ban”. So maybe he got few days ban? Just check in few days.

Support doesn’t exist on AGS, just deal with it. I have got 3 bans because always the same group of people report me for chat abuse, when I just write to sell things, the automated system is broken and it is abusable, big companies can make players got banned through the inneficient system they have. Fortunately I have got a “permanent ban” and then unbanned almost immediatly because it was bullshit, I don’t know how it works, but I think if I got banned because some players hate me because I’m solo player and I’ve done 1vX many times an won and they got mad and reported me, the system is awful.
I have appealed to all my bans and I always receive an copy paste response.
In conclusion, AGS support is almost unexistant or directly it do not exist.

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I do feel for your friend and the problem it has caused for him and your group of friends. I took no offense, I completely understood what you meant. I certainly would like to hear if ASG does surprise your friend with an email apologizing and trying to make amends like in my situation. Best of luck!!

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This happened to me as well about 2 months after launch. It was a known bug and a restart was all it took to get you back in. Never heard about someone getting banned over it

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hope that’s true “only bug”

this game make me scared , 2 of my friend just got banned for cheating reason
my friend nickname : voctrax
server : delos
just got banned permanent

for cheating reason
while he just level up his logging skill from 40 to 175 and boom banned permanent

just wasting time and money buying this new world and get banned for cheating reason , just becaue raising trades skills

scary.

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