Ways to avoid using OP combos of weapons without any penalty

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Lately i been seen too much “wierd” weapons combos just to get a Root ability or a quick escape.

GA + IG: Full STR for full damage and IG just for the ice root.
Hammer + VG: for the root.
Bow + VG for the extra damage and root.

The main problem i see here is the ability to use ANY weapon regardless your stats. And the only “penalty” you get, is low damage. But all the other benefits still there. Roots, stuns, slow, empower, fortify works the same. On a full 300 int mage, as on a full 300 str bruiser.

(I just saw a video of somebody in the PTR using Blunderbuss and Void Gaunglet for a deadly combo).

Now for the suggestions / Ideas:

1. Status requirements for weapons.
As we all know, all weapons increase damage by one or two stats. New World could add to that system a “minimum stat requirement” o equip certain weapons also based on item lvl (so low lvl players can use all weapons too)

Hammer:
Item lvl 1 - 20: Requires 20 str to equip
lvl 20 to 45: requires 50 str to equip
lvl 45 to 55: 100 str
lvl 55 to 60: 150 str

(same increment could go for any “one stat” weapon).

In the case of 2 stat weapons like SNS, Musket, VG, could be:

Void Gaunglet:
Item lvl 1 - 20: Requires 15 int and 5 focus to equip
lvl 20 to 45: requires 35 int and 15 focus to equip
lvl 45 to 55: 70 int and 30 focus
lvl 55 to 60: 100 int and 50 focus

This numbers could be tweaked, but you get the idea. This way why could avoid, or at least penalize user that take a secondary weapon just for an specific ability, and don’t have 1 point in the corret status to use it.

I myself used for a few days GA as a secondary weapon with my main Fire Staff, just to have a quick escape ability and a nice root with 5 str.

I know this idea maybe a little disruptive, cause its based on a penalty for the players that want to user this kind of combos.

2. Scale all abilities and status effects from player status:
Another way to solve this, could be that the stats (STR, DEX, INT, etc) affect not just the damage of the weapons, but also the effects of it.

So, If i use a GA with 5 STR my gravity well could have a super short range, short duration and shorter root. But a 300 STR player use it and will have full range, duration and root.

The same for Ice Gaunglet. Low int, your ice wall could last just 1 second, and have a tiny root effect. But for a full mage 300 int mage, it will be the ice wall we have now.
Or Ice storm in low INT could be shorter and smaller, and in full INT could be bigger and last longer.

Also they could make status effects use this same system:
Bleed effect: Last longer the more DEX you have.
Empower: Last longer the more STR/INT/DEX you have
Fortify / Regeneration: Last longer the more CON you have.
Mana regen / Resistance to root/stun: Last longer the more FOCUS you have.

I think both ideas could work. But of course need more thought on it.

Let me know what you all think.

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Only real comment i have on this, is that as a focus user i either wouldn’t be able to equip anything other than a void gauntlet offhand, and only if i invested in int. Or the second option again i wouldn’t really have a use for the offhand even with VG being my only option there as well.

I like the versatility of the different combos personally, and the unique builds that come from them. I’d hate to take them away, because people will eventually come up with counter combos for those specific weird builds. Like emergent gameplay.

I’ve seen it happen too many times in games where they start adding more artificial restrictions until all of the classes and weapons eventually are soft or hard locked out. Or all of the classes eventually are pretty much the same but with different graphics.

Just my shower thoughts.

ps:
Consider also that as a focus user my only option in PVE as well as PVP is to be heavily reliant on the abilities of the weapons because they do little to no damage. So i am only able to rely on say, the spear stuns or hammer stuns, Gaxe Gwell ect to survive.

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Yeah, maybe a Healer full FOCUS could have a hard time with this system.

But in game, what weapons does Healers use off hand, if not VG?.

Maybe an addition to this system could be that if you put an Amber gem (converts damage to nature and scales with FOCUS). Now the requirement for that weapons becomes 50% Focus based.

This way you could equip a hammer with 50% of the STR requirement. Or have decent stuns, staggers, with its abilities. For me, it’s kind of weird to see a Healer pulling off a Hammer to Stun a bunch of enemies. The same as for being a FireStaff mage being able to use GA for stun and escape. Doesn’t seem right with no penalty or requirement at all.

But i think the problem on Life Staff it that it doesn’t have any decent damage ability. On the beta there was a nice AOE ability that hitted very hard, but AGS took it off.

This kind of system could help a lot to balance weapons. Most of the threads about OP weapons comes from the combination of 2 weapons. Not just one.

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Personally i use hammer about 90% of the time when i’m out and about, heavy set with onyx, and i use heavy swing/stun for pve groups or Gaxe. void gauntlet is good for what it does, but it’s frustrating to use in pve.

I think the biggest penalty is that the offhands do very little damage. My hammer stuns do like 200dmg, but i still get the stun.

Of course, i’m biased here because i don’t want to lose the effectiveness of the abilities that you are specifically mentioning here xD

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And, i have definitely been on the receiving end of a GA/VG that rooted and proceeded to beat the brakes off me with the anti healing perks. But i just see that as a specific build that’s good at what it does, but it lacks in other departments. Which for me opens up more options, i don’t want less options.

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Yeah.

But in fact, i don’t think it would be less options. It would be more fair options.

Like, you want to use a Hammer as a Healer. Then you going to heal a little less, and hit a little harder with the Hammer.

Or me with the Fire Staff and GA. I would need a little STR to hold the big ass axe to hit harder and have a decent root.

It’s kind of weird that a GA user with 5 INT has the same effectiveness using Ice Wall that a 350 INT mage.

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You forgot GA+VG, anything+IG

Anyway I like your second idea of making all the effects scale with the stats

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I just think that this would unfairly penalize these builds, as tri stat builds would be less viable than the pure counterparts. They would never be slotted in wars or groups. And right now these odd builds only work for what they do. So healing a little less to do a little more damage would mean i can no longer use that build.

Same thing with any of the odd offhand STR builds. This would just remove them from the table. As it stands, an offhand VG hits like a wet noodle with no INT or focus. It also does 0 damage as an offhand this way. So you are dependant on your main 3 damage/and M1 to get the job done. And only benefit from the offhand root/empower.

Taking it this route, STR users would lose GRIT for an underpowered offhand and lose a good bit of damage, simply making the choice unviable. In my opinion.

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Just from my perspective of seeing what rolls through the forums, it’s like.

people complained about GA/WH until they had a stroke.

Now there are alternative builds coming out using offhand VG and IG.

I mean do you want them going back to just GA/WH again or?

And i mean BB is coming out this month, so there’s gonna be that whole mess xD

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Again i apologize for stamping all over your ideas. I just personally don’t like the idea of penalizing it for the sake of penalizing it. If it was broken in some way that absolutely one sided the game then yeah i’d be screaming in the forums with the next guy. But i have yet to see it break a meta over a pure build to be a big enough issue to start nerfing offhands, or pouring time into further adjusting balances on top of the already high number of adjustments they need to make to balance things the way that they are.

But that’s just my opinion! So i hope to hear other ones.

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Yeah, i made this thread after seen a video of the PTR with a BB and VG melting ppl.

Being able to have 300str 100int 100con using VG root and then full burst with BB sounds way to OP for me. And what’s the current solution for that? Nerf the BB?. Nerf VG?.

I like better any of my 2 options. No nerf needed for the weapons. Just don’t allow full stat players to use any offhand weapons with no penalty at all.

This same situation with my idea would be:
Blunderbuss requirement for lvl 60: 100STR + 50INT
off hand VG: 100INT + 50 FOC.

So to be able to use that combo, you would need. 100STR, 100INT, 50FOC as minimum. And your root wouldn’t be as effective as a 300INT mage.

No problem at all. I like having different opinions on this post.

I think this is one the reasons this idea may work. The current system is SUPER hard to balance, it’s fun to check the forum and find “BOW too OP, BOW makes no damage, FireStaff OP, Mages make no damage”, and so on.

This is one of the problems i can see in the future:

The build is 200str 100int 150con. Having 150 con, and being able to do that kind of damage, is not good (Maybe BB needs a nerf too in this case).

But you can see he uses all the effects of the VG first having just 100INT. And then full burst.

  1. VG empower 2. VG lowers armor 3. VG roots.

A STR user could still have 300str. But would need to have a little less Con if want to use so odd offhand weapon.
GA/WH would be the same as always in this scenario.
WH/SNS the same (i don’t know any SNS user that doesn’t have at least 50 dex)
SPEAR/BOW same as today. No change at all. (DEX and STR Build).
FS/IG same
FS/VG (almost same, you would need some FOC to be more effective with the VG)
FS/Rapier (Almost the same, just 50dex. But your bleed effects and riposte wouldn’t be as effective as a rull rapier build)

I get your opinion and find it perfectly valid. Let’s see what other ppl think about this too.

EDIT: In the sake of examples i’m combining my two options some times. It doesn’t have to be both options working together. But could also work.

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Your replies are far more fleshed out than mine, as i don’t play some of these other builds enough to know the typical loadouts. I just know that for me personally, i wouldn’t want to have to dump 100 points into str to use a hammer or sns, or anything like that or be severely penalized. As for me that would be a really big deal and i’d be dead meat.

But that is a flip side comparison because i don’t use them to do damage, i use them to avoid damage. So maybe it’s apples and oranges.

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I would love to hear more feedback from other players on this topic.

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Option 2, abilities scale with primary stat, seems reasonable. I think option 1, having stat requirements for each weapon, might be too restrictive. It would primarily only impact healers currently, but who knows in the future.

Another novel idea would be to make all CC abilities really short in duration, but their duration scales with constitution. At 250 constitution, the CC abilities would last how they do now, and at 300 constitution they’d last a little longer than live servers. The idea behind this approach would to give tanks a purpose. Tanks would be in charge of CC. It would also prevent people from having access to big CC and big damage.

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I like the idea of giving Tank Builds more options for having more CON. But i don’t think the best idea will be to make CON a must have for CC.

Every stat should be good for something so all builds are possible. But i think there should be at least a small stat requirement or small penalty for using a weapon that you don’t have the requirements.

Like in Elden Ring, you can use every weapon from the start, but you will suck at it if don’t have the requirements to use it.

I’m a mage with 5 STR (wet noodle arms), but i can use a Great Axe like if it was made from paper.

This idea could also make room for new perks for weapons and armor.

Ej perks:

Lightweight Weapon perk: Lowers for x% the main stat requirement for a Weapon and the weight. ( Lets say Hammer needs 150str at level 60. It could lower it by 50% to just 75str).

Lightweight Armor perk: Lowers the weight of the armor so you can keep medium/light roll with better armors. (Not related to this post, but i like the idea)

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