Why are people allowed to sell their places in dungeons?

It’s pretty clear that people are buying gold on the internet then using that to buy places in dungeons. These people will then get shards/chests for doing absolutely nothing. Why is this allowed to happen?

This is pay to play with the exception that Amazon is not getting the money. I have no doubt that the people who sell gold online are the same ones doing these shard runs.

Do something about it Amazon.


While buying in-game gold via real life money is illegal (RMT), using in-game gold to purchase in-game, player derived services is not illegal, per the Code of Conduct.

These are two separate issues, the 1st being the RMT, the 2nd being the “boost” service of selling shards.

While the 1st issue violates the Code of Conduct, the 2nd issue does not and AGS has said that this is emergent player behavior, selling an in-game service for in-game currency, similar to the emergent behavior of Elite Chest Runs (ECRs).

That being said, I have both sold and bought 6k shard runs with gold I legitimately earned in game, so until AGS makes the Umbral Shards BoE and tradable, or makes another equally fast way to earn them aside from M10 Expeditions, shard selling will likely continue to be a part of New World.


Where did they say this is “emergent player behavior”? Post the link. If they did say this then it needs to be definitely looked at once again. The same people are spamming this in the trade channel everyday.

How is someone logging into a dungeon for one minute and not doing anything for a reward beneficial to the game? Players are selling spots in dungeons as a workaround because shards are not tradeable. In my mind that clearly makes it an exploit.

ECRs take time and some effort this does not. The rewards from M10s are the best in the game and on a different level from anything found in an ECR. They are completely different for those reasons.

I simply block players that advertise shards. I think my mute list filled, as mute doesn’t seem to be effective.

My apologies for mis-remembering the emergent behavior part, but please see AGS’s response regarding Shard Selling linked below:

Continuing the discussion from People Selling Umbral Shards:

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Because AGS supports RMT??in silence way LoL

Continuing the discussion from Code of Conduct:

AGS does not support RMT.

RMT is not needed to buy shards in-game.

Buying shards in-game is perfectly legal.

Amazon is moving to a seasonal model for the game. If the rewards include shards they have a vested interest in making shard selling against the TOS.

RMT is used for the shard selling by many players who do not accumulate the gold legitimately in game. That is pretty much a fact.

Thats why i said in silence way…you saw them already tried so many things to stop shard selling but in silly ways haha…when they can just easily make the rewards only for people who do minimum 1k damage to last boss like world boss events

Have u seen how many shards u’ll get from season pass?only as many as 1 gold m10 run xd

Shard selling is a trust trade/unenforcable and can be scammed.

I have no idea why they consider this legal.

I do have to question why AGS are saying it’s fine to buy items with in game gold in response to an issue raised about players buying shards, yet you cannot trade shards in game because they’re bound to the player :smiley:

I mean, I get it… they don’t want to pull the trigger on this one because they made the problem themselves and it’s not a simple one to change (although it can be changed and I have one way of doing it but honestly don’t care really). But the discussion shouldn’t be about players getting punished for doing this. And the fact AGS came out to discuss that without bothering to address the obvious issue that a non tradable item is actually traded for is really disheartening.

I still don’t care. But the failed logical process that resulted in that response isn’t a green flag.

Ultimately, saying this has opened them up to questions about why shards therefore cannot simply be traded. Not that I think this is the solution. But you can’t say “it’s fine to trade items with gold” in this context without also addressing whether shards should be tradable or not.

I was in a company where this happened. A guy refused to pay after the dungeon and then the entire company was not allowed to enter expeditions with others.

Today, the shard traders called a very well known player/streamer a scammer on the trade channel. Their people then said the word “reported” repeatedly. I know for a fact this person is not a scammer in any way, in fact they have helped many in the game with items.

I’m actually starting to consider the benefits of games actually accepting cleaver methods for players to acquire real world currency so long as the rationalization is that players are trading real time valued effort for real world currency and everyone in the raiding party is okay with it. But that would be a very specific instance. My theoretical reasoning is that players could have another interest in playing the game other than playing for fun. And this would fill up lobbies more and there would be other ways for players to make money in today’s economy even if they are below the minimum employment age which could be lucrative for a young enterprising individual. Or even as a side gig for an adult trying to make money for rent.
There would have to be some kind of system or courtesy to be respected but in this day in age where money and entertainment are a juxtaposition maybe we are in that perfect window where players should be able to freely make money on the gaming platform by means of virtual labour.

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If AGS reverses their stance on shard selling, they have every right to do so. But until they do, shard selling is perfectly legal. And as long as shard selling is perfectly legal, players will choose to buy/sell shards.

I personally think AGS should make Umbral Shards BoE, tradable on the TP. Doing so would eliminate most of the Shard Selling phenomenon and drastically reduce RMT.

Regardless of what people use RMT’d gold for, RMT’ing is against the Code of Conduct. One of the ways AGS could cut down on RMT is to get into the RMT game themselves, by selling a set in-game gold (IGG) amount for a set amount of Marks of Fortune (MoF).

WoW has a similar system with their Blizzard currency and IGG/WoW Tokens for their monthly playtime fee.

Since the Umbral Shards are the main benefit, the term “shard selling” gained precedence. But you are also getting the benefit of all the end-dungeon chests. Technically, you are buying the “service” of a “boost” through the Mutated dungeon, but since this is entirely within the game, there is no issue from AGS. The RMT is the CoC violation, but not all Shard Buyers engage in RMT, nor do all Shard Sellers engage in RMT.

AGS could certainly make it much easier by just making Umbral Shards a tradable currency, which then would allow players with vast excess of shard to fill the wants of those players who want shards, stopping the shard selling phenomenon and also drastically reducing RMT. AGS could then remove the 25/weekly Mutation limit, since players would benefit overall from the removal.

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@Ryladryl is right about this.

Its too late for AGS to make shards tradeable because too many people have millions in their storage…if they all sell theirs at TP, price will go down quick.maybe like fibers price LoL then this game have no grinding process anymore because everyone get access to buy shards,not only people with bunch of golds

I totally agree with you. Most of these shards sellers are RMT related.

Also something that I’d like to point out is that sometimes these sellers kick an innocent guy at last boss so they can sell his spot. I have been kicked 3 times in Fresh Start server, that’s why I don’t even bother doing M10 with randoms.

And before someone comes with that bs screenshot: I’m not against selling in-game services for in-game currency BUT it’s stupid you can get kicked at last boss.

AGS should do something like this: if a guy wanna buy M10 rewards he’s gotta do the WHOLE dungeon with his seller and not only join when the last boss is about to die. That’s how buying shards should work imo.


I made 50k tonight just buy buy items off of AH and selling them for more.

I’m not saying this is a lot or anything. Im just saying not everyone paying to go into the expeditions is RMT
It’s easy enough to make gold to buy them